60 Comments - JB13 - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:19 am: The frequency with which that question is asked is a reflection of its importance to the people of this state, who are watching the economic condition of their communities crumble into dust by the day. I am glad the governor is more patient and understanding than you on this one, and will continue to answer it as often as it is asked. And he should continue to do so. - Ben - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:25 am: If no treatment until the fall and no one has staffing at fed or state or local level to trace, looks like nothing changes to 2021. - Ok - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:25 am: Yes, but… The reporters are trying to get a simple answer to the impossible question that everybody is asking - when is this going to be over? Their editors/producers are telling them - the three Ts doesn’t help people know when that is going to be. They will keep asking until a simple answer exists. And the Governor is going to have to keep saying he doesn’t have a simple answer yet, until one exists. - SAP - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:26 am: While many state employees are reporting to their offices or to locations in the field and many more are teleworking, there is a pretty large pool of employees who are getting paid to sit at home waiting to be called back to work. It seems to me that these employees could be put to work on the contact tracing task. - Rich Miller - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:27 am: ===is a reflection of=== Often a reflection of reporters prizing their own question over others. - Kippax Blue - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:29 am: Sure we’d like an idea of changes that might be in store. Alas, as we have devolved into the age of trump anything the governor says can and will be used by the unloyal opposition to twist and bend for perceived political benefit rather than accept or try to improve any suggestion for the public good. It ain’t soup yet; in today’s world it’s not best to give a taste. - SSL - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:39 am: Everyone has their own priorities as someone once said. Reporters are no different, trying to be the one who gets JB to say something different. This is a generational event, and will be one we boomers talk about along with Kennedy, Challenger and 9/11. People are hanging on JB’s every word right now because they are so meaningful. Hope he chooses wisely. - Bothanspy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:43 am: == I mean, it’s not like he’s gonna wait for a reporter to ask a question about schools before announcing his decision.== This. This is important. Reporters ask a question that they know there is no answer to yet, just so they can get a nugget, a phrasing, a word on which to speculate on and hammer in their stories. If you want the source of confusion, it is that. - Unstable Genius - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:48 am: In my opinion, only requirement #3, “treatment”, is logical, and we already have that (hydroxychloroquine and others). There is no way to ensure that testing performed now or in the future is accurate and timely - are we going to test everyone in the state daily??? How do we know that testing provided by multiple vendors is valid and meets minimum accuracy standards??? And it’s impossible now to do contact tracing because of the long time period that one is infectious. So in my opinion, it’s time to open up non-high risk areas (therefore excluding prisons, nursing homes, etc.), and let individuals decide whether to assume the risk of exposing themselves to the public. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:51 am: Oh boy… ===and we already have that (hydroxychloroquine…=== The last study in that was stopped due to heart issues to the subjects. It’s not a safe treatment. == So in my opinion, it’s time to open up non-high risk areas (therefore excluding prisons, nursing homes, etc.), and let individuals decide whether to assume the risk of exposing themselves to the public.=== Ask England how that worked out. Then, ask Ireland why they’re glad they chose not to use herd immunity. Whew. You can’t recover… from your death. - LakeCo - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:51 am: =In my opinion, only requirement #3, “treatment”, is logical, and we already have that (hydroxychloroquine and others)= You’re kidding, right? - Rich Miller - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:58 am: Bothanspy +1 - SAP - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:58 am: Relying on opinions instead of science has contributed just a little bit to the spread of COVID-19 - efudd - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:01 am: Unstable “Genius”- Gotta hand it to you. Never saw a six line troll before. - NeverPoliticallyCorrect - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:03 am: Just love the folks who are giving us all or nothing options. Keep it all shut down until we can do everything. That would make sense if we were seeing a fatality rate multiple times of what it is and the fatalities impacting all subgroups. But we aren’t. If a controlled opening means seniors like me have to live more restricted lifestyles for now then that is worth it. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:07 am: - Birdseed - Living in your head is truly a treat. I’ll send you on you way; start with Brazil and France, they deemed it unsafe to continue *studies*… which is what i typed. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.livescience.com/amp/coronavirus-chloroquine-study-stopped-early.html - Junior - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:07 am: * Ask England how that worked out.* Every European country is far more densely populated that 90% of Illinois. Population density is a thing, that’s why Chicago metro has 65% of the population and 90% of the cases. - Pundent - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:07 am: Pritzker’s short term goal is to get to 10K tests daily. We’re currently testing less than 100K daily across the country. Epidemiologists say that number needs to be in the millions…daily. And depending on your occupation you might require daily testing. That’s what it will take to return to any semblance of normal. We need to mobilize the full force of the government to address the testing shortfall on a massive scale. That means investing in production, test delivery, and rapid results. Best case scenario is that we 12-18 months until a vaccine. Wearing a make at home mask isn’t going to get enough of us across the finish line. My concern is that we get to Pritzker’s magic 10K number and then acknowledge that it’s not nearly adequate. People want to know when this will be “over” we need to be honest with them on how heavy a lift that will be. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:08 am: Oh… === we should tell them to quit using it for all non-Covid related purposes.=== Children argue like children. That hasn’t changed. :) - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:09 am: ===Population density=== Population mobility and the movement of the virus. You keep forgetting that? Why? - Leatherneck - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:17 am: - SAP - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 10:26 am: While many state employees are reporting to their offices or to locations in the field and many more are teleworking, there is a pretty large pool of employees who are getting paid to sit at home waiting to be called back to work. ————— I would think one of the “adjustments” by May 1 would be for state employees to return to work. With precautions if feasible, such as taking temperatures before starting work, wearing facemasks if possible while working, telling people to stay home if even the slightest bit sick, etc. - Da Big Bad Wolf - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:31 am: === (hydroxychloroquine and others).=== Please for the love of God don’t go around telling people that hydroxychloroquine is a cure for Covid-19. It hasn’t been proven to cure Covid-19. People with other diseases who need to take it are really suffering because now they can’t get it. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:40 am: ==and let individuals decide whether to assume the risk of exposing themselves to the public.== Well, I suppose at least part of your screen name is accurate - unstable. - Pundent - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:41 am: =That would make sense if we were seeing a fatality rate multiple times of what it is and the fatalities impacting all subgroups. But we aren’t. = And why is that? What we’re doing right now is working. You seem disappointed that the numbers aren’t higher. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:41 am: ==That would make sense if we were seeing a fatality rate multiple times of what it is and the fatalities impacting all subgroups== What? 23,000 deaths in America. 800 in Illinois. I really wish I could understand what is wrong with you people who think death is acceptable. - TinyDancer(FKASue) - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 11:59 am: =…and we already have that hydroxychloroquine…= Read the FDA insert: https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2007/009768s041lbl.pdf Still wanna take it? Didn’t think so. - Junior - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 12:04 pm: * people who think death is acceptable. * I’m not seeing anyone who thinks its acceptable, but I do see a few people who understand risk and find the risk from COVID too low to risk trashing the economy even further, or losing a business their family worked hard to build. The risk for any one person of dying of COVID is extremely low. - Jocko - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 12:06 pm: ==and we already have that (hydroxychloroquine and others).== As DJT states ‘What do you have to lose?’…other than dying from ventricular tachychardia - Candy Dogood - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 12:09 pm: ===1) Widespread testing (at least 10,000 test results each and every day);=== This is a good goal, this is an okay goal, but I don’t think this is really enough capacity for a state with 12 million residents and many millions of people in the work force. Especially if it is a goal that is intended to go along with reopening non-essential businesses and services because to do that there doesn’t just need to be capacity to test those that are symptomatic, but capacity for preventative screening of individuals before they return to work. It would take about a year just to screen our work force once. - Lester Holt’s Mustache - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 12:09 pm: ==and let individuals decide whether to assume the risk of exposing themselves to the public.== I think you’ve got it backwards there, champ. While you see this as a matter focused on yourself as “the individual”, the rest of us see this as you (the individual) deciding that it’s ok to start exposing everyone else to whatever germs you may have. No offense, but I think I speak for everyone when I say we don’t know you well enough for that just yet. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 12:16 pm: === I’m not seeing anyone who thinks its acceptable, but I do see a few people who understand risk and find the risk from COVID too low to risk trashing the economy even further=== That’s choosing money over lives. I get it, deaths are ok at a rate to keep money flowing. Gotcha. No need to explain further… - Demoralized - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 12:21 pm: ==I’m not seeing anyone who thinks its acceptable, but I do see a few people who understand risk and find the risk from COVID too low to risk trashing the economy even further== So, death is acceptable. You just proved my point. You choose money over life. Nice to know where your priorities are. - Rich Miller - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 12:24 pm: ===The risk for any one person of dying of COVID is extremely low=== Yeah, if you stay home. But go on out there, bub. Maybe volunteer at a hospital or something and decline to wear PPE so that others can protect themselves. Let us know what happens. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 12:29 pm: Candy: The point of being able to test in mass is to be able to know quickly if someone is sick and be able to do contact tracing right away. One of the reasons this got out of control is that the cases started growing exponentially because you could no longer trace who someone had contact with. If you can test quickly on a large scale you can keep the continued transmissions at a minimum. I understand it’s a lofty goal but it’s a necessary goal. - thoughts matter - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 1:28 pm: == there is a pretty large pool of employees who are getting paid to sit at home waiting to be called back to work. It seems to me that these employees could be put to work on the contact tracing task. == I’m going to assume that 1) contact tracing is a pretty specialized and technical process, 2) involving people’s privacy and personal identifiable information. You can’t just throw a much of bodies at it. Nine women carrying a fetus for a month each does not make a healthy baby. - bailbond - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 1:40 pm: “Choosing money over life” sounds like a powerful critique until you think about what it means. We can’t eliminate the risk from this virus—so we take steps to minimize and control that risk (testing, tracing, treatment), with the expectation that we will get to a point where the policymakers and experts reach a consensus about being able to have a functioning economy while minimizing the risk of uncontrollable outbreaks. That point will not be black and white, and reasonable epidemiologists and elected officials will disagree about the precise way to balance those factors. Attacking anyone pushing for some measure of economic activity as “choosing money over lives” is not intellectually honest, since we will all eventually get to a point where we have to accept some risk that individuals may continue to die of coronavirus, but the community impact can be controlled. As the Governor and Dr. Ezike said yesterday, the negative health consequences of unemployment are also very real and severe. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 1:42 pm: === We can’t eliminate the risk from this virus=== Stay at home seems to be working… - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 1:43 pm: === Attacking anyone pushing for some measure of economic activity as “choosing money over lives” is not intellectually honest=== No, it’s brutally honest. You can’t “un-die” - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 1:47 pm: ===…where we have to accept some risk that individuals may continue to die of coronavirus, but the community impact can be controlled.=== You willing to die… for me? A family member? You risk first. I took these three separately because what seems to be thoughtful to science… the reality is… well, it’s this… === That point will not be black and white, and reasonable epidemiologists and elected officials will disagree about the precise way to balance those factors.=== Again, it’s a measure of “money over lives”… oh, and this… === the negative health consequences of unemployment are also very real and severe.=== … which in the presented context is… “People are gonna die either way, so let’s get back to work” Whew. - Pundent - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 1:52 pm: =we will all eventually get to a point where we have to accept some risk that individuals may continue to die of coronavirus, but the community impact can be controlled.= Staying at home was the mechanism to buy us time. Fix the supply chain issues to replenish critical supplies (hasn’t happened) get the testing to an acceptable level (hasn’t happened) put the procedures in place for contact tracing (hasn’t happened). The message from Pritzker is the same as it ever was. You have to make progress in these key areas to support the reopening of the economy. Nobody wants to continue to destroy the economy. But the things that need to happen to prevent this and get people back to work aren’t happening. Simply saying that we have to open things up without taking the steps that Pritzker lays out is to deny how we got here in the first place. And yes, if you don’t do these things you are making the choice of money over life. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 2:01 pm: == since we will all eventually get to a point == You said a key word. Eventually. The people pushing a re-opening of everything right now are valuing money over life. I understand that this virus will be with us forever now and that people will get sick and die in the future. My issue is with the people who seem not to care we are in the middle of a crisis right now and want to place money over lives right now. - Jocko - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 2:02 pm: ==pushing for some measure of economic activity== No one is stopping you from creating a Ameritrade account, buying groceries/takeout, or playing online poker…but we are asking that you stay at home until we get a handle on this virus…which the states (unfortunately NOT the federal government) are trying to do. - Last Bull Moose - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 2:06 pm: I do not understand the “no deaths are acceptable” position. Death is inevitable. When and how we can influence. I would not take the risk of riding a motorcycle, but I know people who do. Each of us takes risks every day. Some we can’t avoid and some we choose to take. Covid 19 is unusual. Our actions can put other people at risk. That shifts the decision from the individual to the group at risk. (If drunk drivers only killed themselves, we would not work so hard to stop drunk driving.) Much of our delaying action is buying time for medical advancements to cut our individual and group risk. We will have to manage through some high risk times. Until there is a vaccine, I hear no discussion of eradication. I expect that we will work out ways that reduce risk, but not eliminate it. Years ago to work in a grocery store I had to have a chest x-ray. Tuberculosis was a risk to be managed. Requiring store employees to have masks is not really different. - Stoney - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 3:14 pm: My question is where and who is going to be doing all of these tests? I retired in 2013 with more than 35 years working in medical and analytical chemistry labs. The kind of numbers they keep talking about would be overwhelming. - Dotnonymous - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 3:20 pm: - Junior - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 12:04 pm: * people who think death is acceptable. * I’m not seeing anyone who thinks its acceptable… losing a business their family worked hard to build. Worried about inheriting the family business?…Junior? - Pundent - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 3:34 pm: =Much of our delaying action is buying time for medical advancements to cut our individual and group risk.= We didn’t have a plan in place to deal with the pandemic. The stay at home orders were an opportunity to pause, minimize disease spread and loss of life, while a plan was put in place. But were still lacking in the fundamental aspects of the plan. A solid plan will preserve lives AND our economy. A lousy plan or the absence of one will do neither. The two go hand in hand (even better with gloves). - Pundent - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 3:45 pm: =My question is where and who is going to be doing all of these tests?= To do it at a effective level it will likely require a new industry created specifically to address pandemic testing. It’s been compared to a war time effort given the mass scale needed. The numbers are debatable because much is still being learned. But there seems to be evidence to suggest that the minimum daily testing is likely tenfold of what we’re doing today and likely far greater. This is a lengthy but good article on the topic: https://www.vox.com/2020/4/14/21218074/coronavirus-plans-social-distancing-end-reopen-economy - Leatherneck - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 3:50 pm: “Years ago to work in a grocery store I had to have a chest x-ray. Tuberculosis was a risk to be managed. Requiring store employees to have masks is not really different.” Hopefully if feasible, maybe this pandemic can bring back this chest X-ray requirement to work in stores, restaurants, etc. involving food or sale of other items for human consumption (including clothes). And also no smoking allowed on premises during work hours by employees–not even during breaks. - ESR - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 4:00 pm: Those (OW, demoralized, etc) who savage others that dare speak of the costs of an extended shuttering of the economy, snuffing out the ability of people to work and provide for themselves and their families, are either unaware or ignoring the thousands of ways that our country weighs the costs and benefits of certain activities every single day, and accepts a certain level of death as necessary to a well functioning, prosperous society. For instance, we could save thousands of lives every year by banning cars, but it would be devastating to our economy so we allow them and instead institute rules of the road to minimize deaths. We could require all homes and businesses be constructed with materials and specifications to make them tornado and hurricane proof, thereby saving lives. But we don’t, because it would be cost prohibitive. We could mandate that instead of water treatment plants filtering out 99.9% or so of contaminants, they must filter out 99.99999%. But again, we don’t, because it would cause water and sewer bills to skyrocket. We accept certain level of deaths pursuant to all sorts of activities every day that are necessary for a society that can function and work as well as it can for as many people as possible. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 4:03 pm: === who savage others that dare speak of the costs of an extended shuttering of the economy, snuffing out the ability of people to work and provide for themselves and their families, are either unaware or ignoring the thousands of ways that our country weighs the costs and benefits of certain activities every single day, and accepts a certain level of death as necessary to a well functioning, prosperous society.=== That’s one long sentence. My retort? You can’t “un-die” - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 4:08 pm: === banning cars…=== Dorms are closed, head home. === businesses be constructed with materials and specifications to make them tornado and hurricane proof, thereby saving lives=== Never been to Florida, the Carolinas… see they are susceptible to hurricanes. We are susceptible to this virus. You understand how that works… right? === We could mandate that instead of water treatment plants filtering out 99.9% or so of contaminants, they must filter out 99.99999%. But again, we don’t, because it would cause water and sewer bills to skyrocket.=== … or your straw man would… drown. I’ll let you can choose. === We accept certain level of deaths=== Carr accidents, water filtration, your ridiculousness are not global pandemics. Make sure you take your recreational marijuana with you when you check out of the dorm room. Thanks. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 4:12 pm: ==who savage others that dare speak of the costs== I do to those who think opening up things right now is a good thing. As for the rest of your “argument?” It’s nonsensical and not worthy of a response. - Pundent - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 4:20 pm: =ho savage others that dare speak of the costs of an extended shuttering of the economy= A long winded diatribe indeed. But nowhere in your rant do you acknowledge the preconditions or planning necessary for any of this to occur. Pritzker has provided his version of the “rules of the road” which you acknowledge as necessary for safely driving a vehicle. No one is remotely suggesting that we can’t or shouldn’t open the economy. But doing so without a plan would be like taking down all of the traffic lights in town. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 4:34 pm: ==For those arguing that we need to stay at home indefinitely== Who has argued that? What is being argued - and I’ll type really slowly for those of you that have a bit of reading comprehension difficulties - is that the arguments for opening up things now is a monumentally bad idea. I don’t know when things will be “calm” enough to do that but the consensus seems to be in the next month or so some things could start back up but the consensus also seems to be this “opening up” is going to take months to fully implement. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 4:36 pm: ==Or do we all just stay home forever and let the country burn to the ground slowly?== Oh, and if you are going to argue try not to do it like a child. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 4:37 pm: === For those arguing that we need to stay at home indefinitely=== Not ONE person said that. This isn’t Facebook. Try harder. === You all accept a certain number of deaths from the flu=== The foolish who compare the flu to a global pandemic that has shut down countries everywhere are those who rarely understand why others need to protect them from themselves. === There will never be 0 COVID deaths per year again most likely. So what is the number?=== Yeah, you’re not very good at this. See, you don’t like the argument of the three T’s, you really don’t like that being called out for choosing money over lives makes you look bad, so you think making others choose a number, instead of sticking with the 3 T’s is really smart and winning. Again, you’re not good at this. - ESR - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 7:23 pm: Yeah that was a long, poorly constructed sentence OW. I appreciate you managing to muddle through it. Your penchant for imagining anyone who disagrees with you as a weed smoking, dorm dwelling, pop tart eater aside, the fact remains there are consequences for the artificially imposed economic destruction that is taking place. These consequences are not only short term, but will also reverberate for years to come and can’t be undone. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 7:28 pm: === These consequences are not only short term, but will also reverberate for years to come and can’t be undone.=== Pandemics are like that. Saving lives is critical. Choosing money over lives, that’s not an option to the Governor, that’s what he said. === artificially imposed economic destruction that is taking place.=== Stay in place is saving lives, it’s lowering the death count. That’s what experts are saying. If you don’t like that… whew. - Last Bull Moose - Tuesday, Apr 14, 20 @ 9:24 pm: The Governors criteria seem correct, if they can be met. I have no idea when they can be met. Can we stand still till August? I don’t think we can. Supply chains will break down and the level of global interdependency will be clear What is Plan B? Do we add back activities in blocks and see how hospitalizations rise? - Blue Dog Dem - Wednesday, Apr 15, 20 @ 4:21 am: ESR. Some good points. I won’t demonize you. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.