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Sun-Times uncovers Cayman Islands investments by Rauner, Rauner’s firm and Rauner’s charity

Monday, Aug 4, 2014

* The front page of the Sunday Sun-Times

* From the story

Multimillionaire Republican Bruce Rauner has channeled at least part of his fortune into the Cayman Islands, a Caribbean paradise long criticized as a tax haven for American investors, the Chicago Sun-Times has confirmed.

A Rauner spokesman insisted that the former private equity investor has met his legal tax obligations and properly disclosed to the federal government information regarding at least five investments by him or his firm in a country that has no income tax and a financial system cloaked in secrecy.

Rauner’s campaign has refused so far to release a full set of his most recent tax returns to corroborate that and perhaps show the extent and value of those investments in offshore companies. No one has suggested Rauner has done anything illegal. In fact, offshore investments among the wealthy have been a common practice in recent years.

For Rauner, consistently leading Gov. Pat Quinn in mid-summer polling, it’s the same political issue that President Barack Obama used to his advantage against uber-rich Republican Mitt Romney in the 2012 presidential campaign.

Three of the five Cayman investments were done through GTCR, Rauner’s former firm

“Bruce’s personal tax rate and state tax obligations are not impacted by where the GTCR subsidiary funds are located” [said campaign spokesman Mike Schrimpf].

The other two

A fourth Cayman Islands-linked investment was The Overlook Partners Fund LP, from which Rauner disclosed receiving a capital gain of at least $5,000 in 2012 on his state economic-interest statement. The Overlook Partners Fund is a non-GTCR-related investment fund for which Rauner’s personal funds were used, his campaign said.

On his economic-interest statement, Rauner also declared having at least $5,000 worth of stock holdings or deriving $1,200 or more in dividends from a fifth Cayman Islands-based entity, HSBC Holdings PLC. A campaign aide said that investment belongs to Rauner’s family foundation.

One other point from the story

In addition to their tax advantages, Cayman Islands investments typically aren’t accessible to most Americans because they can require minimum $500,000 or $1 million deposits, [ Richard L. Kaplan, a University of Illinois law professor] said.

* From the Quinn campaign…

“Republican billionaire Bruce Rauner doesn’t just use exotic methods to dodge taxes - he even uses exotic, offshore locations.

“Who ever heard of a candidate for Governor of Illinois stashing millions of dollars in the Cayman Islands to avoid paying Illinois and U.S. taxes?

“Whether Mr. Rauner’s tax dodge is legal is beside the point. It’s wrong.

“Mr. Rauner has a duty to disclose how much of his fortune he has hidden in the Cayman Islands and explain why he chose to send his wealth to a notorious tax haven that is shrouded in secrecy and available only to corporations and the uber-wealthy.

“These revelations also demand new scrutiny of his finances. Not only must Mr. Rauner reveal his full tax information - he must reveal whether he has any other foreign investments and just with whom he is investing overseas.”

Rauner is running millions of dollars in negative attack ads that are financed by money he obtained by jumping through elite loopholes to avoid taxes.

Sheltering his money in the Cayman Islands to avoid taxes isn’t the first time that Rauner has been caught gaming the system to enrich himself while the rest of us play by a different set of rules. In July, the Chicago Tribune reported that Rauner used elite tax strategies to avoid Social Security and Medicare taxes in previous years and drastically lower his own tax burden. For more information, visit www.RealRauner.com.

* The DGA has eight questions…

1. Why did Bruce Rauner park his money there if not to game the system for his own financial benefit?

2. How much money does Bruce Rauner have in the Cayman Islands?

3. What kind of tax obligations did Bruce Rauner dodge or withhold from Illinois and the United States by sheltering cash overseas?

4. Why won’t he release his complete income tax records with schedules for full transparency and disclosure?

5. What other types of investments or financial interests is Bruce Rauner hiding?

6. Will Bruce Rauner fully disclose the amounts, the locations, and the partners of his foreign investments or holdings?

7. Does Rauner have foreign business partners that do business with the state of Illinois?

8. Would these wealthy foreign investors stand to benefit if Rauner were elected governor of the state?

* And from the Quinn campaign this morning…

Following new revelations that Bruce Rauner has been stashing millions of dollars in the Cayman Islands to avoid U.S. and Illinois taxes, Democratic nominee for Lt. Governor Paul Vallas will discuss why it is more important than ever that Rauner disclose his full tax records.

WHEN: 10 a.m.

WHERE: 12th Street Beach – Northerly Island

- Posted by Rich Miller        


208 Comments
  1. - Obamas Puppy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:04 am:

    …and the Tribune oh I mean Rauner field HQ, not even a mention. Is there any doubt that they have thrown away any their impartiality?


  2. - so... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:07 am:

    Before the Quinnbots all get here, a challenge:

    Explain to me, exactly, how having foreign investments allows Rauner to dodge even a penny of his tax obligations. Show your work, please


  3. - CircularFiringSquad - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:08 am:

    Could someone tell Mr. Shrimp no one is accusing Flip Rauner of not paying what he says he owes. The question is what did he dodge with this trick. How many payments on the condos, ranches, villas got covered with Cayman checks? Cars? Biz trips? Meals? How much income from Cayman companies was included in the $53 million “income” reported on ‘12 and who are the “partners”


  4. - William j Kelly - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:08 am:

    I remember a time when this behavior would have been considered 100% UN-American! Oh wait I STILL CONSIDER IT 100% UN-American!


  5. - Empty Suit - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:10 am:

    While Vallas is pontificating about Rauner’s legal finance activity maybe he can also talk about his (Vallas’s) financial dealings including state contracts.


  6. - OneMan - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:10 am:

    …and the Tribune oh I mean Rauner field HQ, not even a mention. Is there any doubt that they have thrown away any their impartiality?

    Or just perhaps, the word exclusive might mean, that the Sun Times had this little story all to themselves. That is what I think exclusive means in news reporting.

    I mean it is even possible the Quinn folks figured this out and leaked it to the Sun Times, bypassing the Trib.


  7. - Reality Check - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:10 am:

    It is not accurate to say that GTCR is “Rauner’s former firm.” While he relinquished his title as chairman upon “retiring,” Rauner still owns GTCR and its funds. As long as he owns it and makes money from it, he is responsible for its actions.


  8. - so... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:11 am:

    ==Could someone tell Mr. Shrimp no one is accusing Flip Rauner of not paying what he says he owes. The question is what did he dodge with this trick. How many payments on the condos, ranches, villas got covered with Cayman checks? Cars? Biz trips? Meals? How much income from Cayman companies was included in the $53 million “income” reported on ‘12 and who are the “partners”==

    BZZZT!, wrong. U.S. citizens are required to pay taxes on worldwide income, and the Caymans have reported all U.S. bank accounts to the IRS since 2009. Try again.


  9. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:12 am:

    “More like this, please.”

    Big props to the DGA, Big!

    Those would be the questions I would list if I had to come up with “questions” to the Rauner Crew.

    ===“Bruce’s personal tax rate and state tax obligations are not impacted by where the GTCR subsidiary funds are located” [said campaign spokesman Mike Schrimpf].===

    How so? The optics make any Dopey statements to refute this seem - “Romney-like”? And there it is, “Romney”, in Illinois… Yikes.

    ===In addition to their tax advantages, Cayman Islands investments typically aren’t accessible to most Americans because they can require minimum $500,000 or $1 million deposits, [ Richard L. Kaplan, a University of Illinois law professor] said.===

    “It’s baloney, anyone can do it…”

    Yep, if you have $500K laying around, anyone can do it.

    ===A Rauner spokesman insisted that the former private equity investor has met his legal tax obligations and properly disclosed to the federal government information regarding at least five investments by him or his firm in a country that has no income tax and a financial system cloaked in secrecy.===

    “Hammer and shake” sounds so much better than “legalese” and spinning, and dodging, and…dodging.

    “Drip, drip, drip”, lol.

    How many voters can claim they met all their tax obligations, and have at least $500K laying around their business or their person to partake, in a possible tax… reduction… tactic?

    It’s the “Romney” comparison that both Bruce Rauners fear.

    It’s real, the optics stink, and the legalese excuses won’t help.


  10. - Rich Miller - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:14 am:

    ===Or just perhaps, the word exclusive might mean, that the Sun Times had this little story all to themselves===

    Correct. It’s not a conspiracy, it’s about the network.

    The AP picked up the story, but the Tribune is not part of the AP network. They’ll have to find another way to get to this. The AP got to the Trib’s story about federal disaster relief money going to the NRI program by quoting Mark Kirk’s demand for an investigation.


  11. - VanillaMan - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:16 am:

    This isn’t illegal.
    It is his money.
    He has paid his taxes.

    If this is a problem, then change the laws. If this is a problem for Democrats, then they need to take a look at their own party members doing the same thing and demand that if they wished to remain Democrats, then they need to either pay more in taxes at a rate above and beyond the legal requirements set by the IRS, state, and local governments - or drop out of the political offices they are current holding.

    For every Rauner, there is a wealthy Democrat doing the exact same thing.


  12. - OneMan - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:16 am:

    CircularFiringSquad -

    Doubt if this is the reason, but once went to a presentation for owners of small aircraft (primarily homebuilt) that explained the logic of setting up a trust in the Cayman Island to provide an additional wall of legal protection if your aircraft was involved in an accident. This was not too long after Bob Colins died in his crash and the idea was that by setting up the trust, you had a better chance of shielding some personal assets from a settlement if you had a serious accident.

    The dude went on how you could use about 20+ countries in succession to protect some assets from legal settlements and how a surprising number of rich folks did this with some of their assets as an ‘o crap’ protection. The trustee would pay you living expenses out of your assets but would not pay a settlement because it wasn’t in the interest of the trust.

    It was a very interesting idea and I have to admit during that time when I was working in the .com world and had a lot of stock options, the idea was kind of appealing..

    Again, not likely the case here but there are arguments for the offshore account thing beside tax implications.


  13. - Demoralized - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:16 am:

    I would pound this home to the electorate as much as possible if I were Quinn. Perception is reality and to most people the perception here stinks.

    And, by the way @so, there are tax benefits to this otherwise nobody would do it.


  14. - Jimbo - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:17 am:

    Just as I thought, Walgreens wasn’t about Walgreens.


  15. - Demoralized - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:18 am:

    @VMan:

    Sheesh, for somebody who is always beating on Quinn for optics you’d think you’d be a little more consistent when it comes to things like this. You want to explain to me how this doesn’t look bad?


  16. - so... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:19 am:

    ==And, by the way @so, there are tax benefits to this otherwise nobody would do it.==

    Such as? Surely you know, right?


  17. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:20 am:

    ===For every Rauner, there is a wealthy Democrat doing the exact same thing.===

    Spinning this away from Rauner reminds me that Rauner can NOT walk away from this, so better find others that may be like Rauner? lol…

    “But, they do it!”

    Yeah, um ok. Pathetic spin there.


  18. - Adam Smith - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:20 am:

    The only hope Quinn possibly has is that Illinois voters are more turned off by rich people doing what rich people do, than they are by rank, utter incompetence and a state sinking deeper and deeper while “populists” decry success.

    Yep, Rauner’s finances are very complex. They are designed to minimize his tax liability. I try like heck to minimize mine too, and I use every legal means to do so.

    All this is is another in the never ending attempts to distract voters from failure and make voters hate success.


  19. - Anonymous - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:22 am:

    People talk about tax loops but nobody does much about them. Write your state legislator and congressman crybabies.


  20. - Jose Abreu's next homer - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:23 am:

    I’m holding my breath waiting for Penny Pritzker to comment on this important issue.


  21. - Chris - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:23 am:

    “Rauner still owns GTCR and its funds. As long as he owns it and makes money from it, he is responsible for its actions.”

    So, the SERS–they own part of GTCR’s funds, in the same way that Bruce does now–is also responsible for GTCR’s actions?


  22. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:24 am:

    - so… -,

    Ask President Romney how it all worked out, with all that legalese and such.

    Yeah. It’s all legal and swell. Can it be enough to spin a win?

    It’s a hit, plain and simple, and a hit without an easy pivot.

    Making others try to defend optics adds to the elitism of being able to do it in the first place.


  23. - so... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:25 am:

    Still waiting for someone to tell me how foreign investments can reduce a U.S. citizen’s tax liabilities.


  24. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:27 am:

    ===Still waiting for someone to tell me how foreign investments can reduce a U.S. citizen’s tax liabilities.===

    Check out the “Romney” White House to really hammer and shake your point home…


  25. - so... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:28 am:

    ====Still waiting for someone to tell me how foreign investments can reduce a U.S. citizen’s tax liabilities.===

    Check out the “Romney” White House to really hammer and shake your point home…==

    So that’s a “no” from Oswego Willy. Gotcha.


  26. - Louis G. Atsaves - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:28 am:

    ===Whether Mr. Rauner’s tax dodge is legal is beside the point. It’s wrong.===

    So following the Quinn campaign logic: It is wrong to follow the law? What a crazy world we now live in. Legal is now wrong.

    In the meantime, Congressman Brad Schneider, a Democrat, still refuses to release his tax returns for the years 2011, 2012 and 2013. What “tax dodges” did he use? What legal deductions did he take and of course, they are all wrong!


  27. - William j Kelly - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:28 am:

    One possible compromise would be to elect rauner governor of the cayman islands and let REAL AMERICANS get back to work!


  28. - walker - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:29 am:

    This is Rauner’s Achille’s heel, because it exemplifies what the public most fears about him. Greedy, and taking unfair advantages not available to most taxpayers.

    Quinn’s equivilent is the Fed case, because it attacks his biggest saving grace.

    It is obvious from their response, that Rauner’s rehab doctors have been fully preparing for this day. And equally obvious why some pages were missing from the previous tax returns that he has shown.


  29. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:30 am:

    ===So that’s a “no” from Oswego Willy. Gotcha.===

    You know there isn’t a Romney Administration, right? lol.

    The optics of the deed far outweigh what the deed does or doesn’t in the legalese.

    I know, politics is hard sometimes…


  30. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:32 am:

    OW, the polls show a majority of national voters wish like heck that Romney was president, less than 2 years from the election. It is about performance and leadership. Quinn = Barry.


  31. - Jimbo - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:33 am:

    Adam, it isn’t success people hate. They hate what some do with their success, and also generally take a dim view of success that has come from less than above board dealings. You know, like buying a governorship with money from pension funds of those he despises and cutting costs to the detriment of patient safety at nursing homes. Also, even though the tax code allows capital gains to be taxed lower than much of our income, the proles generally don’t like the idle rich paying lower taxes just because they use their money to make money rather than labor. I realize Bruce works for a living, but he seems to get all of his compensation in cap gains. I don’t think it is fair that I pay above 20% plus SS when he skates with 15% and wants to reduce his state taxes too. Isn’t that the reason he’s running? To save 2%?


  32. - George Washington - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:35 am:

    I doubt anyone on here does not try to use every legal advantage available to reduce their taxes, i. e. filing status, exemptions for children, etc. I use an exclusive tax write-off (unavailable to those who can’t afford to buy a house) by legally exempting my interest off my home loan. If people are upset by legal laws, then change the laws. Don’t complain about those using them to their advantage.


  33. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:36 am:

    ===OW, the polls show a majority of national voters wish like heck that Romney was president, less than 2 years from the election.===

    In Obama’s Illinois?

    If a PAC or Quinn’s Crew decides to take this to the Romney 47%, the Carhartt and watch, the ranch “losing” money… it exacerbates the comparison both Bruce Rauners fear.

    There’s probably a reason for that.


  34. - so... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:36 am:

    ======So that’s a “no” from Oswego Willy. Gotcha.===

    You know there isn’t a Romney Administration, right? lol.

    The optics of the deed far outweigh what the deed does or doesn’t in the legalese.

    I know, politics is hard sometimes…==

    So still a “no”. Keep at it buddy, I’m sure you’ll figure it out!


  35. - olddog - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:37 am:

    @ so… === Still waiting for someone to tell me how foreign investments can reduce a U.S. citizen’s tax liabilities.

    OK, I’ll try:

    1. They don’t.

    2. But that’s not the issue here.

    If you’re still confused, maybe this will help:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_herring


  36. - Abe the Babe - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:37 am:

    ==Explain to me, exactly, how having foreign investments allows Rauner to dodge even a penny of his tax obligations. Show your work, please==

    So im sure people send $ to the cayman islands for the fun of it. Or maybe they just think it sounds cool.

    Caymans has no income tax so whatever the fund makes there wont be taxed. There’s one benefit for starters.


  37. - Plutocrat03 - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:37 am:

    Show me how Rauner is not paying taxes due and I will pay attention.

    In the meantime PQ and buddies are using public monies to make themselves look good and that’s OK?

    What a silly world we live in.


  38. - Rich Miller - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:38 am:

    ===Explain to me, exactly, how having foreign investments allows Rauner to dodge even a penny of his tax obligations. Show your work, please===

    Now that’s a silly comment. Why? Because it’s the whole reason why Quinn has been pushing Rauner to release all his tax documents. Until he “shows his work,” nobody else can.

    IOW, you might wanna rethink that line of attack.


  39. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:39 am:

    - so… -,

    I’ll look toward to President Romney stumping for Bruce Rauner. Yikes.

    ===Don’t complain about those using them to their advantage.===

    Attention voters;

    Just keep your mouths shut! I’m rich, I can do what I want. Get rich than do what I do!

    Yeah, that, ===Don’t complain about those using them to their advantage.=== is a swell retort…to the “little people”


  40. - Robert the Bruce - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:40 am:

    ==Still waiting for someone to tell me how foreign investments can reduce a U.S. citizen’s tax liabilities.==

    This isn’t a tax blog. And you might be moving the goalposts by speaking of foreign investments and U.S. citizens specifically, rather than a foreign holding company and a U.S. business interest.

    But if having a holding company in the Cayman’s doesn’t help one avoid taxes, why would Rauner bother? Was he really vacationing there, ran out of money, and had to set up several holding companies so he’d have enough cash to afford to buy his kid a lemonade at the beach?


  41. - William j Kelly - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:45 am:

    I knew Rahm’s sloppy seconds would hurt the Republican Party. Replace ‘offshore rauner’ now!!


  42. - Norseman - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:45 am:

    I’m sure this is to allow him to get a little walking around money when he visits the islands.


  43. - John Boch - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:45 am:

    Borderline ad hominem attack.

    Are we going to discuss issues in the race or how much (or little) money each candidate has in their personal portfolio?

    How many of us were ever hired by a poor person?

    What’s wrong with a successful businessman running our state? We’ve had how many years with a not-so-successful or effective governor? How much worse could it be?

    And I’m hardly a Rauner fan…

    John


  44. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:45 am:

    OW, in Quinn’s Illinois. Dismal performance and non-existent leadership mean something. And, none of the “foreign investments” would have mattered in the presidential race if Barry would have told the truth about Obamacare and Benghazi.


  45. - A guy... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:46 am:

    I read it yesterday. I read it again today. Twice. I’ll wait to hear what the amazing Paul Vallas has to say. Nice to see him checking in now and again. Perhaps this might make a splash. But, I just don’t think it does. Except for the interests of people who are already “not” voting for him. So far, not much there there. No fed indictments, no illegal maneuvers, no investigations, no, no, no. We’ll see. But this pile doesn’t look to me like a sticker.


  46. - Anonymous - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:46 am:

    class warfare is fun


  47. - Jimbo - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:48 am:

    Louis, I don’t see anyone defending the Congressman here. Regardless, “he does it too” is not a valid excuse. Rich people behave in ways the middle and lower classes find objectionable. Politicians exploit those feelings. It happens on both sides and it really isn’t unfair considering the advantages rich people start with. Rich people try to avoid taxes. It is universal. Most of us don’t have the advantages of their loopholes and tax attorneys or we’d do it too, but us less fortunate people look at them, with all they have, trying to stiff uncle Sam with complex tax avoidance schemes (legal or not) and well, we don’t like it.


  48. - Noy Noy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:51 am:

    If this stuff didn’t poll well, why does the Illinois Freedom SuperPAC have a SECOND ad attacking Rauner for using a loophole to avoid Soc Sec & Medicare taxes?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VU1aWPTn3p8


  49. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:52 am:

    ===And, none of the “foreign investments” would have mattered in the presidential race if Barry would have told the truth about Obamacare and Benghazi.===

    “If/Buts, Candy/Nuts”..,

    Romney lost. They painted Romney as an elitest, 1%er, hiding cash in the Caymans, and an elevator for his car…

    Rauner has 9 homes, stashed money in the Caymans…

    You see a playbook being run?


  50. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:54 am:

    ===So far, not much there there. No fed indictments, no illegal maneuvers, no investigations, no, no, no. We’ll see. But this pile doesn’t look to me like a sticker.===

    “Amen!

    Signed,

    President Romney”

    I love the ===No fed indictments, no illegal maneuvers, no investigations, no, no, no. ===

    The spinning away from the optics is dizzying.


  51. - Jimbo - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:55 am:

    John, that “only rich people have given me jobs” line is tired. Without labor there is no capital. It isn’t the other way around. Those rich men who’ve given you jobs… They were extracting capital from your labor, not spending their capital to give you a job out of the kindness of their heart.


  52. - Noy Noy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:55 am:

    Willy,

    Can you ask President Romney appoint Bruce Rauner ambassador to the Cayman Islands to save us from 3 more months of this guy?


  53. - so... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:56 am:

    ==This isn’t a tax blog. And you might be moving the goalposts by speaking of foreign investments and U.S. citizens specifically, rather than a foreign holding company and a U.S. business interest.==

    Private Equity investments are limited partnerships. Limited partnerships are flow-through entities and their income is reported by their owners on their personal income tax returns.

    Nice try though.


  54. - Robert the Bruce - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:57 am:

    @so…

    So, we did our best to answer your question.

    So…your turn. Why do you think the Cayman accounts existed - to reduce taxes or for another purpose?


  55. - Grandson of Man - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:58 am:

    We need to see Rauner’s full tax returns and extent of his Cayman investments. Why? Because a multimillionaire was ripping on thousands of middle class state employees, calling them overpaid, calling their union leaders corrupt, threatening to terminate their contracts, insisting on ending their secure pensions and wanting to shut down the government.


  56. - A guy... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:59 am:

    === Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:54 am:

    ===So far, not much there there. No fed indictments, no illegal maneuvers, no investigations, no, no, no. We’ll see. But this pile doesn’t look to me like a sticker.===

    “Amen!

    Signed,

    President Romney”

    I love the ===No fed indictments, no illegal maneuvers, no investigations, no, no, no. ===

    The spinning away from the optics is dizzying.====

    Hardly spin Wilbur. People have had more than enough time to “digest” the great Romney strategy from the Obama team. It’s not a surprise if you’ve seen it before. We’ve seen it before.


  57. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:00 am:

    - Noy Noy -,

    My position in the Romney Administration precludes me from suggesting any/all appointments. Vice President Paul Ryan is really the point person. I will do my best, since you asked.

    ===Private Equity investments are limited partnerships. Limited partnerships are flow-through entities and their income is reported by their owners on their personal income tax returns.===

    What a swell retort when the Romney/Rauner ads start…powerful!


  58. - Ducky LaMoore - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:03 am:

    Yep, we know… it’s not illegal. Nobody is talking about law, Raunerbots. This is a political campaign. And this looks bad. Very bad. Just face up to it and quit your whining trying to defend the actions of a shoddy candidate.


  59. - Big Muddy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:04 am:

    Who would I rather have as Governor:
    A guy that has been in Illinois politics his entire life?
    Or
    A guy that made his own fortune in the private sector albeit utilizing every legal means to do so?

    Quinn didn’t get to where he is because he is free from sin and neither did Rauner. This is all about class warfare. Nothing more.

    I’m tired of private sector success being punished. You take away the positive results of hard work and determination and the American dream dies.


  60. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:08 am:

    - A Guy … -,

    Wilbur again? I don’t have to guess now which end if the horse you are, lol

    ===Hardly spin Wilbur. People have had more than enough time to “digest” the great Romney strategy from the Obama team. It’s not a surprise if you’ve seen it before. We’ve seen it before.===

    Than what are you saying? Nothing?

    The Cayman Island flyover Ads, the the optics…maybe Rauner will do better than Romney with it(?)


  61. - Sbarro McArby's - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:08 am:

    I like Big Muddy’s logic - Bill Brady lost, and he was a rich guy who didn’t have Cayman Accounts, so the GOP is sure to win this time b/c they have a rich guy who does use Cayman accts


  62. - Sbarro McArby's - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:10 am:

    Quinn needs Oberweis’ helicopter to fly over the Caymans and tell us where Rauner is stashing his tax-free money


  63. - Bill White - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:11 am:

    - VanillaMan - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 10:16 am:

    This isn’t illegal.

    = = =

    Rather a low bar for our elected officials


  64. - Ducky LaMoore - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:11 am:

    @Big Muddy

    This guy ain’t exactly Henry Ford. People that have had the joy of working for companies that have “consultants” to “make us more efficient” know exactly the type of person he is. First, we take all of these overpaid people that built this company and get rid of them. Next we replace them with low wage workers, they could be anyone really. That makes the books look real nice and we can sell for a profit essentially using the track record of all the people that got canned. Been there done that. I’ll take the career politician.


  65. - walker - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:11 am:

    For Immediate Release:

    Rookie Star Has Blown Achilles

    Crossbow McKinsey, independent scout, reports today that Bruce Rauner, star running back for the Illinois Barons, has a badly ruptured Achilles tendon. Team spokesman Smarts Scrimpf, says “It’s a high-ankle sprain, easily repaired. We had hoped to bandage it up and nurse it along through the playoffs, but now that’s impossible. Our team of doctors already prepared a rehab program tailored for Bruce, and it started with a stiff boot today.”

    Famed sports orthopedic surgeon Willy O’Willy commented “We know these types of injuries can take as much as six months for full recovery, and the ability to quickly pivot can be permanently lost.”

    When asked by reporters why this injury to a key player was not disclosed earlier, the Barons issued a statement: “We will get back to you on that shortly.”


  66. - ok... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:11 am:

    apart from us political nerds on here, i doubt the general public will care.

    don’t vote for a rich guy with money in the Cayman Islands that pays a lower tax rate than me? where have i heard that before? i think voters in the collar counties and suburbs of Cook County won’t fall for that one again unfortunately i think Obama’s popularity has something to do with that. what would have surprised me would have been the opposite. is kept his money here and payed the same tax rate as middle class Americans.


  67. - Bill White - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:13 am:

    To amplify and extend Jimbo’s point (which I agree with):

    == John, that “only rich people have given me jobs” line is tired. Without labor there is no capital. ==

    Without consumers there are no jobs

    It’s like the board game Monopoly when one player has all the properties, hotels and cash and the other 5 players are broke. Game over.


  68. - so... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:14 am:

    ==@so…

    So, we did our best to answer your question.

    So…your turn. Why do you think the Cayman accounts existed - to reduce taxes or for another purpose?==

    Well, based on the Sun Times story, two of the five funds (GTCR Golder Rauner II AIV Ironshore LP, GTCR Partners IX AIV Ironshore LP) look like they were related to a company called Ironshore. A google search shows that Ironshore is a Bermuda-based insurance company that GTCR took a minority stake in in 2009 http://www.gtcr.com/gtcr-announces-agreement-to-invest-in-ironshore-inc/

    So, in that case, at least, it’s in keeping with the campaign’s explanation that GTCR created offshore subsidiary funds when they invested in foreign companies.

    And the HSBC bit is just silly. HSBC is a UK-based bank, and Rauner’s investment was in the form of the bank’s common stock which is traded on the New York Stock Exchange.

    Finally, tax exempt investors, like pension funds, have to jump through a number of legal hoops in order to avoid being hit with the federal Unrelated Business Income Tax. Offshore funds help facilitate that.


  69. - Sbarro McArby's - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:14 am:

    When a rich guy doesn’t have a voting record, you attack his business record.

    Don’t Illinoisans have the right to know anything about the jamoche who wants to be Governor?


  70. - Rufus - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:15 am:

    I am a liberal and not pleased with either of the two choices we have for governor.

    Having said that, in 2012 Rauner paid $10,136,134 in federal tax, and $2,657,192 in state taxes. IMHO he contributed his fair share.


  71. - Phenomynous - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:15 am:

    Last I checked, Rauner was running against Quinn, not Obama. I understand the want/need to look at 2012 as a model. But keep in mind the landscape is quite a bit different.


  72. - Formerly Known As... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:16 am:

    == On his economic-interest statement, Rauner also declared having at least $5,000 worth of stock holdings or deriving $1,200 or more in dividends from a fifth Cayman Islands-based entity, HSBC Holdings PLC. A campaign aide said that investment belongs to Rauner’s family foundation. The investment is also one in which every suburban and downstate teacher has a stake because the state Teachers Retirement System holds $67.2 million in HSBC stock. ==

    The amount of investment will be key here. Are we talking about $5,000 or $5,000,000? Is this comparable to a nickel from one of us or the down payment on a house?

    Also, because of the nature of this particular race, how long until Quinn is somehow blamed for allowing $67,200,000 of state money to be invested in the Caymans, whether he has anything to do with the investment board or not?


  73. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:16 am:

    ===apart from us political nerds on here, i doubt the general public will care.===

    You go with that…

    There have been polls discussed hear about the word Billionaire, and if anything Romney/Ryan taught us, is that an alleged tax skirting billionaire doesn’t poll all that great.

    Politics and legalese together is almost always a political fail in the optics of spin.


  74. - Taxandspendfolly - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:16 am:

    So the attack on Rauner comes down to this: he is very successful (heaven forbid!) , and he did not pay more in taxes than he owed. This is class warfare at it’s best. If you don’t like the federal tax laws, change them.


  75. - Jimbo - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:16 am:

    To everyone saying that Rauner isn’t receiving any kind of tax benefit by incorporating these shells in the zero tax Cayman Islands… Are you saying he’s a bad businessman then? I mean I’m sure it isn’t cheap to form these companies there, not to mention paying for proper oversight. It seems like a poor financial decision to incorporate there without achieving any kind of tax benefit. So the choices are: Rauner is avoiding taxes, or Rauner wastes money incorporating in foreign countries to the detriment of his business and partners and is a bad businessman. /halfjoking


  76. - Jechislo - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:16 am:

    It’s not illegal. Rauner did not break the law.

    This is analogous to the Quinn political ad that states that Rauner used a tax loophole to avoid paying Social Security taxes.

    That would be like saying that most posters on this blog used a tax loophole to avoid paying income taxes. What loophole? Deduction of their mortgage interest from their Federal income. That’s not illegal either.

    We’ll all find out what was done illegally about 1 month from the election when the investigation into Quinn starts back up.


  77. - liandro - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:18 am:

    Class warfare was always going to be the main game for Quinn, and reading all the cheerleading for it makes me a little sick. Doesn’t solve anything, and it won’t be used to start any serious and needed policy discussions. When I see Quinn, and all his cheerleaders, actually fighting for federal tax reform I’ll maybe give them the slightest benefit of the doubt.

    For now, I’ll call it what it is: standard campaign season hypocrisy. Pretend to care about something that is far more important to politicians as a political weapon than it is as a serious policy goal.

    Tax reform is something I believe in. Quinn does not, certainly not enough to use it as anything other than a political cudgel. While the Quinn cheerleaders see a potentially useful attack, all I see is another missed opportunity to push real ideas and reforms to the fore.

    Although if Quinn was any good at that he probably wouldn’t be in political danger anyway, since even people like me would be voting for him wouldn’t be voting against him.


  78. - Just Saying - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:18 am:

    REVERSE LOGIC AD SCRIPT

    Pat Quinn and his pals are criticizing Bruce Rauner for not paying MORE taxes than he’s required to by law. They say Rauner is a bad citizen for paying only what the regulations requires him pay…and not one penny more.

    Do you know who else Bruce Rauner thinks should pay less in taxes?

    You.

    Bruce Rauner. Lower taxes, less government.


  79. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:20 am:

    ===IMHO he contributed his fair share.===

    Good strategy with an IRS audit;

    “I paid enough!”

    - walker -, can I have an office to see patients in the Caymans? I am hearing its beautiful there…


  80. - Jimbo - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:21 am:

    BIll, I almost tacked on the fact that because there are many many moor poor and middle class people in this country who are responsible for the demand any business seeks to supply, they are infinitely more responsible for your job than your employer.


  81. - Sbarro McArby's - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:21 am:

    Quinn is calling for Fed tax reform - getting rid of the inversion loophole.

    Rauner is somewhere b/w supporting inversion and dodging the questions


  82. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:22 am:

    - Just Saying -,

    Sounds swell, except Rauner wants to raise the state income tax as part of his “Plan”,

    Really good idea, except for that income tax wrinkle he wants back up…


  83. - Coffee Cup - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:22 am:

    As long as Rauner has not done anything illegal by parking his money there, then I have no problem with it. Actually, this just solidifies in my mind why I want this guy to administer the money (or lack of money) that the state of Illinois has (or does not have, unfortunately).
    Rauner is a “smart guy” and is far more clever with handling financial matters than our own loveable but financially inept “Dufus”, Pat Quinn.
    As long as Mr. Rauner is operating within the legal boundaries that our country has put into law, then “write me down as being on Bruce Rauner’s team”. The good lord knows that we need somebody like Rauner to pull our bacon out of the fire.


  84. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:23 am:

    What Rufus said!


  85. - Formerly Known As... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:23 am:

    This loses its luster upon learning that the State of Illinois has money invested in at least one of the exact same investments.

    Unless there is more forthcoming, this is not nearly the shot that sinks his battleship.


  86. - so... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:23 am:

    ==To everyone saying that Rauner isn’t receiving any kind of tax benefit by incorporating these shells in the zero tax Cayman Islands…==

    The United States and the State of Illinois tax worldwide income. The fact that the Cayman Islands don’t levy an income tax has no effect on what Rauner owes Uncle Sam.


  87. - Sbarro McArby's - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:26 am:

    All you Raunerbots spinning this into something positive for him are ignorami.

    Admit your candidate has a negative and just argue the Governor’s negs are even worse.

    It’s a race to the bottom election, people


  88. - PolPal56 - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:26 am:

    It’s amusing how many people who are defending Brucie’s legal right to park money in Cayman accounts are the same who think it’s just fine to ignore the Illinois Constitution when it comes to State retirees whose pension income are fractions of fractions of fractions of Brucies’s.

    Legal is legal. The optics are horrible, but Brucie is within his legal rights under current US law to stash his fortune offshore. Is this a surprise? Really? Did any of you seriously think otherwise? I assumed he had offshore accounts - the surprising thing about the story to me is that it’s put forth as a big deal exclusive. Seriously.

    It used to be that “the rules don’t apply to the rich.” That’s almost been tilted on it’s head now. The uber-wealthy have been working hard to rig the game so the rules are all in their favor, and eliminate rules, such as the pension clause in the constitution, that protect the rest of use.


  89. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:27 am:

    ===The United States and the State of Illinois tax worldwide income. The fact that the Cayman Islands don’t levy an income tax has no effect on what Rauner owes Uncle Sam.===

    There’s your radio Ad retort.

    Make sure you mention “Cayman Islands” and “taxes” so the hit Ads have more punch.


  90. - Jimbo - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:31 am:

    So…, except it does. Rauner has to pay taxes on distributions. Undistributed profits of those entities aren’t taxed. If it was a US based business, it would owe taxes on its profits and Bruce would owe on his distributions. Look, I’m not saying I wouldn’t do it, I’m just saying that yes, BR’s entity paid fewer taxes than it would have if it were incorporated in the US. If this, or something similar were not the case, we wouldn’t be discussing the Caymans. Saying it made no difference doesn’t pass anyone’s smell test.


  91. - Black Ivy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:32 am:

    Really? Is this the best that the Chicago Sun-Times can dig up? Wow, I am unimpressed as Rauner, his family, and businesses can do what they wish with their hard-earned money. #muchadoaboutnothing #keepitmovingbruce


  92. - Bill White - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:37 am:

    Oswego Willy @11:27 a.m.

    I started to type a careful reply but deleted it when my snark meter starting sounding a delayed warble. Better check the batteries.


  93. - Ginhouse Tommy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:37 am:

    Bruce Rauner said that he the taxes that he owed. Okay. He has the right to look for tax havens and short cuts just like the rest of us do. He can also hide his money better than we can because the ultra rich do have that privilege and opportunity. Point taken. What remains to be seen is what the voters of the state think on this. If they believe he resembles J.R.Ewing more than say Warren Buffet they will vote for the other guy. Yes I know Buffet is worth more. This campaign just gets more interesting the closer we get to November. The problem is there is no clear cut winner who is head and shoulders above the other.


  94. - 47th Ward - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:38 am:

    ===The fact that the Cayman Islands don’t levy an income tax has no effect on what Rauner owes Uncle Sam.===

    Hmmm. I wonder if that’ll fit on a tee-shirt.


  95. - A guy... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:42 am:

    One guy has proven he is utterly incompetent to run state government. The other guy has proven he’s utterly rich. Your choice which is more damning.


  96. - illinifan - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:43 am:

    Here is how the accounts help to avoid taxes…

    Cayman accounts do not report income earned (interest) to IRS.

    They also also American taxpayers to invest in U.S. companies without accruing a tax bill with the IRS. By establishing personal offshore entities, Americans appear to be foreign investors and avoid paying U.S. taxes on investments in American firms.

    Yes it is legal….yes he pays all taxes that he is legally responsible to pay…it is time to establish tax laws that do not favor the well-heeled over the barely-shod public


  97. - Formerly Known As... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:48 am:

    Mike Frerichs wants to divest the state of overseas investments?

    How about we start by divesting of our state’s investments in the Cayman Islands? /s


  98. - too obvious - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:51 am:

    Leave Rauner alone. Obviously he has to keep that money offshore. If he invested it in Illinois he might help create jobs and opportunity and his whole campaign is based on badmouthing the state and sowing as much despair as he can. Same reason he worked against the only pension reform bill on the table.


  99. - Archiesmom - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:53 am:

    I am completely with Willy here. I saw the headline and first word in my head was “Romney.” I predict this will get a load of play from the Quinn campaign when they go negative big time, which I think will be in September.


  100. - Formerly Known As... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:58 am:

    Let’s just hope there aren’t any quotes by Governor Quinn in support of Penny Pritzker or her investments in the Caymans.

    Not after the glowing praise from and dismissal of those concerns by President Obama, Senator Durbin and so many other Illinois Democrats.

    Both parties are such hypocrites on this. When “my guy” does it, everything is fine. When “your guy” does it, we are outraged.

    Especially with our own state investing $67.2 million in at least one of these exact same “scandalous” investments.


  101. - Soccermom - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:58 am:

    Let’s start a list of all the things that are not illegal but that are still wrong…

    Gosh, Louis, you’re setting the ethical bar very, very low.


  102. - A guy... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:07 pm:

    === Archiesmom - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:53 am:

    I am completely with Willy here.===

    Take an aspirin, lie down, cool rag on your head. It won’t go away, but the intensity will diminish rapidly.


  103. - Cassandra - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:10 pm:

    This just means he’s a finance guy with a lot of money. Which we knew. No reason to think it’s illegal. I believe some well known corporations have held and probably still do hold money in the Caymans.

    Rauner has to have known this plutocrat stuff would come up when he decided to run. He may have to do some more explaining as November approaches but presumably, unlike Romney, he’ll be well prepared on the issue. Romney, rather astonishingly, was not.


  104. - forwhatitsworth - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:16 pm:

    Simple way of looking at this. Why do people use the Cayman Islands for their investments? Will somebody please simplify this for me?


  105. - wordslinger - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:16 pm:

    Geez, it is what it is. The Cayman Islands is for tax avoidance or money laundering, take your pick. That isn’t breaking news; been that way for quite some time. Try the google.


  106. - Meanderthal - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:16 pm:

    This was all legal and, from what I am told, a very common way to structure foreign private equity investments.
    None of this makes Quinn any more competent to run state government.


  107. - OneMan - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:17 pm:

    I do have to say nice work by the DGA on this, too bad those guys didn’t have jobs keeping track of NRI money or Quinn might not need this much help….

    (rimshot)…


  108. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:17 pm:

    Oh, - Archiesmom -,

    Taking medical advice from the wrong end of a self-proclaimed horse is dangerous. You be careful, and thanks for supporting the comment I made.


  109. - so... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:25 pm:

    ==Cayman accounts do not report income earned (interest) to IRS.

    They also also American taxpayers to invest in U.S. companies without accruing a tax bill with the IRS. By establishing personal offshore entities, Americans appear to be foreign investors and avoid paying U.S. taxes on investments in American firms.==

    BZZZT!, wrong.

    Dealing with your claims one at a time:

    ==Cayman accounts do not report income earned (interest) to IRS.==

    Yes, they do. They’ve done so since 2009. See: http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Elections/President/2012/0120/Why-does-Mitt-Romney-have-money-in-the-Caymans-Two-potential-reasons

    ==They also also American taxpayers to invest in U.S. companies without accruing a tax bill with the IRS. By establishing personal offshore entities, Americans appear to be foreign investors and avoid paying U.S. taxes on investments in American firms.==

    This is so wrong I’m almost uncertain of where to begin.

    The United States taxes income worldwide. It doesn’t matter whether you earned a $1 Chicago or Shanghai, Uncle Sam takes his cut. Unless you are engaging in some pretty serious identity theft, you cannot “appear to be a foreign investor” simply by locating your investments in the Caymans. It doesn’t work that way.


  110. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:28 pm:

    - so… -,

    If you are explaining….

    …you’re losing.

    Politics is hard, optics of message, pretty easy, explaining it away from the political…is losing.


  111. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:33 pm:

    In the words of Bobby Knight(no, I don’t care for the coach,) basketball is like church, many attend, few understand.

    That is why you explain, OW


  112. - Yellow Dog Democrat - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:35 pm:

    Denial ain’t just another river in Egypt.

    Anyone who thinks voters are unfazed by offshore accounts…must think voters are equally unfazed by $18 watches and Carrharts.

    Nothing illegal?

    Um, the Average Joe knows who writes the tax code.

    If you don’t want to hear about the Cayman Islands, my advice is to buy some earplugs, because Quinn is gonna be talking about it for three months solid.


  113. - Demoralized - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:42 pm:

    @so:

    We have no idea exactly what the investments Rauner has looks like so nobody can say what benefits there may or may not be.

    You certainly are earning your pay from the Rauner camp today.


  114. - Demoralized - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:43 pm:

    And a lot of you are completely missing the entire problem here. It’s all about perception. The average person is going to see this and say that it stinks. Doesn’t matter what the truth is. The average person doesn’t care. All they see is some rich guy sending his money offshore. They don’t care about the details. You may not care. I’m nor sure if I care. But to shrug this off as no big deal is a complete denial of the politics of perception.


  115. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:45 pm:

    YDD, good for Quinn. Just like Barry talked about Romney. And the replay from the Rauner camp would be, does it make one bit of difference right now? Quiin is inept and Barry is inept. You gonna vote against someone who is successful and who paid in excess of $10 mil in federal taxes and more than $2 mil in state taxes?

    Rauner’s camp will quickly put the focus back on Quinn’s performance and the dems performance the last 10+ years.


  116. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:46 pm:

    - Wally - and - so… -,

    You both may want to read - Demoralized -’s exceptional comment above.

    Explaining away optics, you are in a world of hurt.


  117. - Demoralized - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:49 pm:

    Respectable people call “Barry” Mr. President, or the President. We see which side of the fence you sit on.


  118. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:49 pm:

    ===Rauner’s camp will quickly put the focus back on Quinn’s performance and the dems performance the last 10+ years.===

    I am confused. If this is all “no big deal” and worth explaining, why the need to put the focus back on Quinn?

    Is it because this does hurt?

    Who is “Barry “? All this derogatory spinning, “Barry” confuses me.


  119. - From the 'Dale to HP - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:52 pm:

    If the Rauner campaign is spending this much campaign time responding to comments on the blogs, I might have to start reconsidering that it is a well run campaign.


  120. - William j Kelly - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:54 pm:

    I wonder how many policemen we could have hired in Chicago if rauner wasn’t hiding is dirty insider deal money from the state.


  121. - Cassandra - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:57 pm:

    I guess we’d have to see some reliable polling, but in the end, we citizens write the tax code through our elected reps and the ginormous federal tax bureaucracy we fund through our federal income taxes. And we citizens have historically been rather reluctant to raise taxes, even on rich folks. We have also been rather reluctant to punish those financiers responsible for the great recession, plenty of culprits there, none in jail that I know of. So how concerned will voters be about Rauner’s use of a well-established tax shelters used by many, many others. I honestly don’t know. Concerned enough to switch their votes to Quinn? Stay home?


  122. - Shark Sandwich - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 12:58 pm:

    Really? We’re going to gripe about ‘Barry’?
    People ought to be free to use artful handles for the pols. You know, stuff like Cousin Brucey, Farmer Bruce, Rauner/the other Rauner, Baron von Carhart, etc.


  123. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:02 pm:

    - Shark Sandwich -,

    Good point. I withdraw my snark.


  124. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:03 pm:

    OW, time for a John Wooden quote!


  125. - Norseman - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:04 pm:

    Sorry Raunerbots, this is not about voting against him because he’s a rich guy. It’s about the ethics of how he got rich and whether he will use his power as governor to help other rich guys at the expense of the little guys.


  126. - William j Kelly - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:04 pm:

    Maybe we wouldn’t have to raise taxes on real people if rauner and his friends weren’t hiding their dirty insider deal money in shady offshore bank accounts.


  127. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:06 pm:

    Nah.

    Maybe quotes from “Weekend at Bernie’s” might be more appropriate with the Cayman beaches…


  128. - skeptic - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:09 pm:

    Let me get this straight, Rauner (who wants to lead this state) parks his money in the Caymans, but that’s all legal beagle, go for it. Jimmy John’s wants to move to Florida to avoid taxes and we’re all up in arms about it?


  129. - Jimbo - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:20 pm:

    Cassandra, Romney wasn’t prepared because he and all of his toadies saw no problem with it. Do you perhaps see a comparison with the Rauner supporters on this thread? I wouldn’t be shocked if they counter with “Bruce paid everything he was legally required to pay” and think that settles it.


  130. - Gooner - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:24 pm:

    Not sure if this was referenced above (I didn’t see it, but with 128 comments, it is possible I missed it) but Crain’s has a good story on Rauner’s denial.

    Once again, here comes Rauner with the unforced errors. The denials are vague and suspicious.

    They are going to give more legs to this story.

    Rauner needs to learn that the best defense is just to come clean. Instead, he’s playing into Quinn’s hands.

    Rauner is going to end up losing this race, and the reason will be that he’s run a terrible campaign.


  131. - PublicServant - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:31 pm:

    So if all my income is subject to federal and Illinois state income taxes, why isn’t Bruce’s?


  132. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:33 pm:

    William j. Kelly, according to a poster, Rauner paid more than $2 million in state taxes in 2012. A LOT more than I paid. How about you?


  133. - William j Kelly - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:39 pm:

    Wally, even if I had all the dirty insider deal money in the world I would still keep it in the USA, but that’s because I was raised to put America first not whatever game Rahm and rauner are playing!


  134. - Gooner - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:46 pm:

    Really Kelly?

    Hey, you are running for office. When are you going to disclose your tax returns?


  135. - A guy... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:47 pm:

    === PublicServant - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:31 pm:

    So if all my income is subject to federal and Illinois state income taxes, why isn’t Bruce’s?===

    Post your last 3 years tax returns up here on CF. Since you’re comparing, let’s hold you to the same standard.
    You think it’s possible he made some of his money outside of Illinois? Is your new tax proposal that Illinois gets a cut no matter where the money is earned?


  136. - A guy... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:54 pm:

    - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:08 am:

    Than what are you saying? Nothing?

    The Cayman Island flyover Ads, the the optics…maybe Rauner will do better than Romney with it(?)===

    Yes, that’s what I’m saying. Especially at the moment it’s discovered the flyover took place with a state plane full of chickens.


  137. - Say It Ain't so! - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 1:57 pm:

    If Bruce Rauner is so concerned about the financial outlook and future of Illinois, why is he investing and depositing his own funds in the Cayman Islands, instead of investing in Illinois businesses and Illinois banks? Apparently personal gain is more important to Mr. Rauner than improving the state he wishes to lead. Apparently he doesn’t want to lead by example.


  138. - searchingfortruth - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:05 pm:

    This entire conversation is rather simple. Rauner is a rich guy that by definition is avoiding all taxes possible. It makes him look like a hypocrite. Bad optics.

    Quinn is a poor leader and unmitigated failure as Governor. This is what a Ralph Nader Presidency would have looked like. Bad Optics as well.

    I think that in the end the “anyone but the boob in office now” sentiment wins out. Just sayin’.


  139. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:07 pm:

    Say it ain’t so———-you must have missed the recent presser where BR promised to deposit a million bucks in a south side bank.


  140. - Demoralized - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:08 pm:

    @A guy:

    You are kidding yourself if you think this is nothing important. You completely fail to grasp the optics here.


  141. - Say It Ain't so! - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:11 pm:

    Wally- Big investment one bank in Illinois, as I remember, politically motivated too. I don’t suppose he promised to withdraw money from his Cayman Islands bank to deposit in that south side bank???


  142. - wordslinger - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:17 pm:

    Some of the spin here is hilarious. How do you think the Cayman Islands got to be one of the world’s largest banking centers — by handing out free toasters?

    It’s a tax haven, with super-sweet banking secrecy laws, like Switzerland and Singapore. It’s where you go to hide assets, avoid taxes and launder money. Those are the only reasons to bank there.


  143. - Archiesmom - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:22 pm:

    -Willy -

    I will be self-medicating later this evening, and will raise a glass to you.


  144. - A guy... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:28 pm:

    == Demoralized - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:08 pm:

    @A guy:

    You are kidding yourself if you think this is nothing important. You completely fail to grasp the optics here.===

    Actually I’m not Demo. I’m not saying it’s no big deal or a great big deal. I’m just not seeing it or hearing it anywhere but here. “The rich guy has an account in ____ or does business with ____ etc.” just doesn’t ring all the bells people think they do. We’ll see over time. The stuff of lawsuits and investigations aren’t just fill for a slow news day. Those are news. And they just keep coming. I’m sure there will be mailers and commercials that accuse Rauner of everything up to shooting JFK. A lot of that is white noise rolled in red meat.

    Whether people have made a decision on Rauner yet isn’t the $64K Question. The question is whether they have made a decision about Quinn. I think a lot of them have.

    Time will tell if this matters at all.


  145. - Anonymous - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:36 pm:

    –Whether people have made a decision on Rauner yet isn’t the $64K Question. The question is whether they have made a decision about Quinn.–

    That doesn’t make any sense. Undecideds and turnout are the ballgame now.


  146. - A guy... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:37 pm:

    ====wordslinger - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:17 pm:

    Some of the spin here is hilarious. How do you think the Cayman Islands got to be one of the world’s largest banking centers — by handing out free toasters?

    It’s a tax haven, with super-sweet banking secrecy laws, like Switzerland and Singapore. It’s where you go to hide assets, avoid taxes and launder money. Those are the only reasons to bank there.===

    I’d seriously question how “secret” they are. Case in point…now.


  147. - MikeMacD - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:41 pm:

    The last time I looked, earnings overseas are not taxed until the money is repatriated. It is taxed in the country where it’s invested, which is where a 0% rate becomes attractive. In this case it’s sort of like an IRA without limits to the investment.


  148. - PublicServant - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:44 pm:

    A Guy - so your saying Bruce only attempted to avoid paying taxes on non-illinois income then?

    And I’d have no problem posting my taxes if I were running for political office. If post everything too. That would be unlike Bruce. See, I’ve got noting to hide, again, unlike Bruce.


  149. - skeptic - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:47 pm:

    “I think that in the end the “anyone but the boob in office now” sentiment wins out.” unless that boob happens to be worse than the boob in office, which is debatably the case in this election.


  150. - Anon. - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:50 pm:

    ==It’s a hit, plain and simple, and a hit without an easy pivot.==

    Really? How about: it’s perfectly legal, I disclosed these investments to the IRS as required by law and in my economic statements, and I paid tax on 100% of the income I received from these investments. The fact that neither Governor Quinn nor any of his staff seem to grasp these simple points, and immediately accuse me of hiding money and dodging taxes when everything was fully disclosed explains a lot about why Illinois is in the shape it is today.


  151. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:56 pm:

    Say it aint so———I answered your question that, indeed, Bruce has or will deposit money in an Illinois bank. Sorry that an affirmative answer is not to your liking.


  152. - wordslinger - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:58 pm:

    Spin all you want, Anon., Cayman Islands banking is what it is. You don’t park your money there to be transparent and pay your full load.

    Secrecy and tax avoidance is the Cayman banking system’s reason for existence. A smart guy like Rauner just happens set up shop there for no good reason?


  153. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:59 pm:

    ===Really? How about: it’s perfectly legal, I disclosed these investments to the IRS as required by law and in my economic statements, and I paid tax on 100% of the income I received from these investments. The fact that neither Governor Quinn nor any of his staff seem to grasp these simple points, and immediately accuse me of hiding money and dodging taxes when everything was fully disclosed explains a lot about why Illinois is in the shape it is today.===

    That will be a fun :30 second Ad, versus the onslaught the Cayman Island / Mitt Romney :30 second comparison Ads pummels Rauner.

    You go with it. Yours is catchy and fun, and will dull the optics, including a newspaper headline too.


  154. - walker - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:01 pm:

    ===it’s sort of like an IRA without limits to the investment.===

    Exactly. Among many, many other tax dodges.

    The claims otherwise are laughable. You can quote the tax code all you like, or what you’ve heard about it from partisan web sites. How it can be used in the real world is significantly different.

    I have been saying for months that this is the one sin that will really sting with Rauner, and I seriously hoped it wouldn’t turn out to be true.


  155. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:06 pm:

    - Archiesmom -,

    I will dedicate my next dose of Plummer Meds to you. Only fair.

    ===Whether people have made a decision on Rauner yet isn’t the $64K Question. The question is whether they have made a decision about Quinn. I think a lot of them have.===

    - A Guy … -, it’s not a referendum on Quinn.

    “Your Guy’s” negatives, if they climb, hurt him, help Quinn. This is not about Quinn, it’s about Rauner v. Quinn, or what Quinn will try; “Romney” v. Quinn…


  156. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:24 pm:

    Let’s see, vote for the guy who said Blago is trustworthy and does the right thing and stood by and did nothing and is inept, or vote for the ultra successful guy who pays tens of millions in federal taxes, millions in state taxes, millions to charter schools and millions to charity.

    Give us time to ponder!


  157. - Walter Mitty - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:25 pm:

    Surprise. Somebody who has wealth can hire folks to keep it. All those like myself that live check to check… Sure if you were in this position you would keep your money in the USA only… This article tries to give hope in some way to a hopeless candidate…PQ… If I had the wealth to keep more of what I made by hiring a team to give me options. Like anyone else faced with this. Me too. I for one appreciate the amount of money someone like Mitt Romney or Bruce Rauner give to charity. I wish I could give more. The practice is not by Republicans or Democrats. It’s by anyone with wealth. Ever wonder how they keep it? Sorry, doesn’t move the needle with anyone on August 4th…


  158. - illinifan - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:27 pm:

    @ wally….$2 mil is a lot but as a percentage of his income how does it look? If you pay 20% of your income in taxes and your income is $40,000 to you $8000 is a lot of money. If you make $53 million and pay $2 mil in taxes and that is 4% of your income the $2 mil falls into the category of quarters in the sofa. For those of us who work for a living we can’t fathom the shear volume of money that is in play in Bruce’s world.


  159. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:30 pm:

    ===…, or vote for the ultra successful guy who pays tens of millions in federal taxes, millions in state taxes, millions to charter schools and millions to charity.===

    “, or vote for the ultra successful guy who pays hundreds of thousands in influencing Democrats and Republicans, pays $250,000 to Payton Prep after Clouting his Denied Winnetka-Living Daughter into Payton Prep, who didn’t have a ‘perfect’ test score, and possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars channeled to the Cayman Islands, possibly to avoid taxes.”

    Better.


  160. - Anonymous - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:34 pm:

    rauner drives another nail in his political platform


  161. - Gooner - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:37 pm:

    Odd that Bill Kelly left after we asked about his tax returns.

    But he had such strong views on the subject, right until that moment.

    We should keep that in mind for future communications.

    Not to digress, but is interesting that Rauner thought he could run without his own tax returns becoming an issue.

    You would think that he would have hired an opposition researcher to dig dirt on himself so that he knew what he was getting into and have been prepared for this issue.

    He’s spending money on YouTube spots, but not on research. He’s got his priorities.


  162. - wordslinger - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:42 pm:

    Wally, what’s your point? No one’s trying to convince you of anything. The game’s between the 40 yard lines now among the undecideds and leaners.

    And Walter Mitty, it only has to move the needle among some leaners and undecideds. It’s not positive in any sense of the word when you’re running for public office in the United States to be parking your money in a notorious tax haven.

    It’s just common sense, like not driving a Mercedes or Beemer at campaign events.

    For crying out loud, why do you think Rauner has been wearing the watch and the Carharrt? To look like a regular guy. Regular guys can’t park money in the Caymans.


  163. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:42 pm:

    C’mon OW, we all need a John Wooden quote!


  164. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:47 pm:

    illinifan, 5% of 53 million is 2.65 million. A CPA would need to chime in how BR’s income is taxed in the state of IL.

    Regardless, $2+ million to the state coffers is a whole lot of juice!


  165. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:48 pm:

    - Wally -,

    The “search” key has the quotes, you find one and share.

    ===It’s just common sense, like not driving a Mercedes or Beemer at campaign events.===

    - wordslinger - is all over the optics. Those who fail to see them face the possibility of disappointment.


  166. - Gooner - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:48 pm:

    “For crying out loud, why do you think Rauner has been wearing the watch and the Carharrt? To look like a regular guy. Regular guys can’t park money in the Caymans.”

    Wordslinger is right, of course, but it points to an inconsistency in Rauner’s message.

    What he seems to be running on is “I’m NOT a regular guy. I’m not your typical politician. I’m a highly successful businessman who can bring a business competence to this state.”

    That was his argument against people like Dillard and Brady. They were the politicians. In contrast, he was the successful outsider.

    But then he does the Carhartt and watch thing, to make him seem like the rest of us.

    So he wants to claim he’s different, but then he still wants to claim that he’s just like the rest of us.

    Those messages seem to be in conflict.


  167. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 3:50 pm:

    I want the doer, the achiever, the successful guy running the state, not some bumbling gadfly or a guy who sat at home and read books and watched kid shows.

    Not that hard to figure out!


  168. - Demoralized - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:00 pm:

    Wally:

    Get your guy to convince me he has the first clue about how government operates or that he has a clue about the state budget then we can talk.

    I could give a flying leap about his business experience. Not the least bit relevant to me.


  169. - A guy... - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:08 pm:

    ===PublicServant - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 2:44 pm:

    And I’d have no problem posting my taxes if I were running for political office. If post everything too. That would be unlike Bruce. See, I’ve got noting to hide, again, unlike Bruce.===

    I believe you.


  170. - Geronimo - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:26 pm:

    Does the word transparency have any place in this discussion? Any candidate who tells hard working folks that they make wayyyyyyyy too much money (while he sits on exponentially larger amounts than they have) is offensive and arrogance at it’s best. Do people think that if he’s our next governor he’ll invest in our state rather than in the Caymans? It’s fairy tale thinking to believe that because he’s done so well, if we identify with him, he’ll make everything magically gold, like his fortune. If you take into account HOW he got the fortune he has, people should be running away.


  171. - Rufus - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:26 pm:

    @Norseman — “whether he will use his power as governor to help other rich guys at the expense of the little guys.”

    My biggest fear.


  172. - Yellow Dog Democrat - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:27 pm:

    Wally:

    I agree with you that Rauner will try to pivot back to Quinn being incompetent.

    Quinn is gonna call Rauner a tax dodger.

    In that debate, the tax dodger loses.


  173. - Walter Mitty - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:32 pm:

    This election will not be about anyone other than who the undecideds feel can do better. PQ is in much more trouble than Rauner for this issue. Optics also include slush funds posed as violence prevention as the city burns. Or a record of no real achievements. I get the optics of the Cayman islands. But many undecideds will choose a guy that does what he does with his money over a guy that doesn’t deliver with our money. I just disagree with most on this. We will see in November who is right. I certainly can’t imagine that if I was PQ I would want to trade optics… Rauner is super rich.. That is not any real news…


  174. - William j Kelly - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:36 pm:

    I left? Really? Get it straight goober, I don’t take orders from you.


  175. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:42 pm:

    YDD, with some maybe. With quite a few they will see constant incompetency. BR has the money to pound away and pound away at Quinn and that message will hit the airwaves and mailboxes soon.

    Harry Reid and Barry called Romney a tax dodger too. They were makin stuff up.

    Enjoy!


  176. - Grandson of Man - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:50 pm:

    “BR has the money to pound away and pound away at Quinn and that message will hit the airwaves and mailboxes soon.”

    Soon? Rauner has already been pounding away at Quinn, yet Quinn is still within single digits.

    We have yet to see Quinn pound away at Rauner. We have yet to see the barrage of negative ads about the nursing homes, long-term care homes, tax loopholes and Caymans.

    We might have a better sense of where this race is at after the barrage.

    The tax loopholes, tax returns and Caymans are scary for the Rauner side. It’s freaking out the Raunerbots and trolls. Why else would they come out in droves to squash the narrative?


  177. - Sangamo Sam - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:51 pm:

    Wow. If Wally is any indication of Rauner-think, we’re in for a bumpy ride.


  178. - Gooner - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:53 pm:

    Actually, Bill, it is “Gooner.” Not that it really matters.

    And I really don’t intend to give anybody any orders. After all this is merely a discussion. It is unfortunate that you concluded that I was being bossy. It certainly was not my intent.

    But in any case, the point with regard to Kelly was that it is very easy to demand to see the tax returns of another.

    However, as Kelly can tell us, actually delivering those returns is another matter. If Kelly ever was a serious candidate, he would understand but that’s another matter completely.

    I do find it very interesting that Rauner apparently did not understand that tax return disclosure would be a major point that would be raised against him by his Democratic opponent.

    You can say a lot about Rauner, but he’s clearly an extremely intelligent individual.

    For somebody so smart, it seems that he did not devote the same sort of effort into research for this campaign (in terms of everything from the basics of how IL govt works to tax and pensions issues to his own background and where the attacks were likely to come) that you would expect from a guy who made a fortune based on quality research of companies to acquire.

    The difference between how Rauner likely was (simply based on his success) as an investor, and the way he’s run a campaign is something I find fascinating.

    It is almost like he thought that all he had to do was write checks and the problems would take care of themselves.


  179. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 5:07 pm:

    Grandson, I mean REALLY pound away!


  180. - Anonymous - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 5:44 pm:

    vulture capitalist send there booty to treasure island to be buried like a pirate would


  181. - Anonymous - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 5:44 pm:

    vulture capitalist send there booty to treasure island to be buried like a pirate would


  182. - Roadypig - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 5:50 pm:

    Grandson of Man - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 4:50 pm:

    The tax loopholes, tax returns and Caymans are scary for the Rauner side. It’s freaking out the Raunerbots and trolls. Why else would they come out in droves to squash the narrative?

    Exactly! The usual bots, plus some of the others who only show up when things get bad for their guy are posting much more then normal today. Like someone else said above- they knew this was coming, so they had their various spins locked ready to use.

    I also love how the bots have been singling Oswego Willy out as soon as possible on any negative Rauner post, usually before he even has posted his own comments. Preempted strikes, if you like. Shows that they are at the least worried about how their guy looks to the rest of the Capitol Fax readers. They keep posting “nobody reads this but us inside politics folks”, but its obvious that they are worried that’s not the truth.

    Keep at it OW- the rest of us enjoy your insights…


  183. - Yellow Dog Democrat - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 6:05 pm:

    Wally -

    Rauner filed a homeowner’s tax exemption on three different properties.

    It is not going to be too hard to make the case. Caymans just make it much easier to grab attention.

    You greatly overestimate how much voters are paying attention to state government in General and Quinn’s performance in particular.

    Yes, Team Rauner will have buckets to spend. You will not outspend Quinn 3 to 1 or even 2 to 1.

    The huge advantage Rauner had coming into June is evaporating quickly.


  184. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 6:08 pm:

    - Roadiepig -,

    Thanks for your very gracious words. You are very kind. I am just glad I get to hang here, I am always learning here from the community, that’s the best part.

    Rich runs a place that won’t be overrun by any candidate, or any message, that won’t face the scrutiny of so many great commenters here. I am one in a chorus, the mistake being made is singling any commenter to score points, instead of letting their message win the day.

    To ===The tax loopholes, tax returns and Caymans are scary for the Rauner side. It’s freaking out the Raunerbots and trolls. Why else would they come out in droves to squash the narrative?===…

    You and - GOM -, and many others see what is going on, when the magic wears off, their talking points only stand up as well as they can on their own.

    Rich’s place is not the best venue to try to spin your way out of trouble, and that’s why I am glad I get to be here too.


  185. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 6:13 pm:

    This story is such a big deal in the Capitol city, it is on page 18 of the State Journal Register.


  186. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 6:32 pm:

    ===This story is such a big deal in the Capitol city, it is on page 18 of the State Journal Register.===

    “This story is such a big deal in Chicago, it is on the Front Page, Exclusively of the Sun-Times.”

    Better.

    Plus, it’s about the Ads that will be generated by the front page of the Chicago Sun-Times, and how much hay making Rauner be like Romney…

    So, how the SJ-R attacks this is not going to matter to Quinn, or even Rauner. The Ads, they will matter.


  187. - Now What? - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 6:52 pm:

    Let’s get right to the heart of the matter: regardless of the legality AND ethics of off shoring wealth, does BR have what it takes to understand the needs and struggles of ALL Illinoisans? I’ll run the risk of being naive and take the swords of my fellow respected posters. Does wealth equal compassion and understanding in governance? History is unreliable here, for both arguments can be made.

    What are we looking for in a governor?


  188. - steve schnorf - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 7:10 pm:

    I have much of my savings in mutual funds. Other than trying to have a basic understanding of their style/niche I pay no attention to what they invest in. I have no idea what companies’ stocks and bonds they buy, and I feel no responsibility for the actions of those companies. I don’t have a heck of a lot of money to watch and generally i do the fund picking myself. Bruce Rauner has a whole lot. I’m more than willing to accept the premise that he doesn’t have any more than a very big picture idea what his financial advisers and managers do with his money as long as the returns are there. I will say it’s an area where some preventive and or curative action might have been a good idea when he started thinking seriously about running for Gov. I don’t but if I bought muni mutual funds I would be just as much (or more) avoiding taxes as he is.


  189. - foster brooks - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 7:28 pm:

    what was the tax rate on the 1% in the 50’s? What was the national debt in the 50’s?


  190. - Arthur Andersen - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 7:51 pm:

    Let’s remember, Rauner is a salesman, not an analyst. He probably figured he could talk, or buy, his way out of any bumps in the road on the campaign trail. This, probably not so much.
    Having said that, I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt on 4 of the 5 investments and an I dunno on the 5th. The GTCR related “subsidiary funds” are not that unusual among PE firms with either offshore investments or foreign limited partners and was not set up “as a Rauner tax dodge,” although that benefit may have happened. The foundation buying common stock in HSBC, just like TRS did, is just a stretch to label as a tax dodge as all the benefits of the HQ location accrue to HSBC, not common stockholders. The other private equity transaction isn’t presented in sufficient detail to render an opinion.


  191. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 8:09 pm:

    OW, pretty sure that is an AP story and easily could have been a page one story where the state Capitol is based. I feel like you are my big brother. You and I should go to a Cards/Cubs game and you can give me insight for 3-4 hours!


  192. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 8:13 pm:

    - AA - and - steve schnorf -,

    Thank you for your clarity.

    Either one of you, in the political, and as a hit, where is the pivot I a not hearing from the Rauner Crew?

    - steve schnorf -

    === I will say it’s an area where some preventive and or curative action might have been a good idea when he started thinking seriously about running for Gov. I don’t but if I bought muni mutual funds I would be just as much (or more) avoiding taxes as he is.===

    That is an Oppo on himself error? If so, how can you pivot off that?

    - AA -, how would you suggest the pivot off that, if unintended consequences did occur? Is this again a possible staff Oppo on himself error?

    The Sun-Times front page and the now Rauner response do not make good optics…


  193. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 8:17 pm:

    - Wally -,

    If I don’t go with - AA - to a Cubs-Cards game first, he’ll never forgive me.

    It’s tough being a contrarian, lol


  194. - Wally - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 8:44 pm:

    Guess I will have to be plan B. Or plan C!!


  195. - Cadillac - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 9:03 pm:

    === You greatly overestimate how much voters are paying attention to state government in General and Quinn’s performance in particular. ===

    Right. The incumbent is down in all polls, but nobody is paying attention to Quinn’s performance. We’ll see how that plays out.


  196. - Arthur Andersen - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:05 pm:

    Willy, I’m an analyst not a salesman so my pivot would probably fall flat. At the outset “if you’re explaining. you’re losing” as the old saying goes.

    If I had to.respond I would say “My company invests to get the highest return for our partners, like the State of Illinois. Part of our job is creating legal means to invest internationally and not create tax problems for our public sector partners. I’ll match our record of returns to the State against any other firm. The issue of the Cayman Islands is irrelevant to these investments and is another desperate attempt by my opponent to change the subject away from his record of failure and federal investigations.”


  197. - Just Me - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:23 pm:

    Okay, I get it, he’s rich.


  198. - Yellow Dog Democrat - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:42 pm:

    Cadillac -

    Pat Quinn has not done much lately to help his cause, but he is behind in the polls largely because Illinoisans have a sour view of our state’s economy.

    It is a poll of our economy and not Quinn.

    We read the newspapers every day and follow the news. Most voters do not.

    Some time ago I pointed to a story about the good news of the economic recovery and how Democrats were slow-walking the story.

    Rauner had three advantages coming out of the primary: his wallet, the momentum and the Illinois economy.

    He still has the cash advantage, but he is no longer on pure offense and the Illinois economy appears to be turning.


  199. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Aug 4, 14 @ 11:49 pm:

    ===At the outset “if you’re explaining. you’re losing” as the old saying goes.===

    That is where I find myself with this whole mess.

    It’s the optics versus the reality, and the reality can’t be explained away in a :30 second sound bite, but it can inflict damage at any commercial time frame.

    The Rauner/Romney comparison, fair or not, is a comparison that those in the middle understand what Quinn is trying to say. The poor spinning here with the lack of response by the Rauner Crew shows where Quinn can hit without a counter directly to the hit.

    Just kinda surprised Rauner’s Crew isn’t better prepared(?)


  200. - Mighty M. Mouse - Tuesday, Aug 5, 14 @ 3:53 am:

    Rauner for Governor! (of the Cayman Islands)

    ‘Bank you very much!

    – Elvis night was just last Friday…


  201. - Wally - Tuesday, Aug 5, 14 @ 7:32 am:

    YDD, just to clarify about the economy, I presume you are talking about the UE numbers? If so, it was repeatedly posted the drop is largely the result of people falling out of the workforce.

    The previous 3 months approx. 46,000 people dropped out of the labor force. One recent month, the number that dropped out was a record in the state of IL. When you drill down some, both nationally and within our stste, the UE % is dropping becuase the labor force participation is at the lowest # since the Jimmy Carter days.


  202. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Aug 5, 14 @ 8:14 am:

    @Wally:

    You certainly have the national Republican talking points down pat on the economy.


  203. - Wally - Tuesday, Aug 5, 14 @ 8:42 am:

    Demoralized—-The facts bro, sorry the truth is painful. As a small businessman, I watch UE and the jobs report pretty closely and don’t just read the headlines.


  204. - I B Strapped - Tuesday, Aug 5, 14 @ 8:52 am:

    I think AA nailed it! It’s diversification of assets and until a US Attorney or some other police authority brings charges and gets a conviction, I for one am happy to say, I wish I had $10,000,000 in a Cayman bank by legal means and a home there with an oceanview. Visited there several years ago….beats the Hades out of Illinois!


  205. - wordslinger - Tuesday, Aug 5, 14 @ 8:59 am:

    –As a small businessman, I watch UE and the jobs report pretty closely –

    That’s a non sequitur. What do macro job reports have to do with operating a small business?

    Unless your “business” is just being a partisan doomsday troll.

    Try reading the Wall Street Journal for news that the economic recovery is finally gaining some solid footing. It might not be good for your “business,” but that’s life.


  206. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Aug 5, 14 @ 9:13 am:

    Walkin’ around money, is for “walkin’ around”, not a promissory note you flash to seem “kool”

    This part of a Ground Game is not rocket science…


  207. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Aug 5, 14 @ 9:18 am:

    @Wally:

    The same numbers have been reported forever. Those that don’t like the narrative it paints like to find numbers that support their particular viewpoint. You fit into the category. You are clearly partisan which is fine. I choose to call you out on your little numbers game.

    I know you partisans don’t like to acknowledge any positive news on the economy because it doesn’t fit your viewpoint. It just makes you look like a hack when you do that though.


  208. - Wally - Tuesday, Aug 5, 14 @ 9:38 am:

    Yeah, ok word. I am not being an %#@&%, but have you ever owned and operated a small business? It just happens that my small business sells services to very large businesses.

    I watch a lot of different indicators, within IL and nationally.

    BTW, if the labor participation rate was the same as when Barack took office, the UE would be 9-10%. The U6 number is double digits. And, baby boomers retiring is not the main culprit for the LPR, as you believe.


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