The big squeeze on higher education
Thursday, Mar 9, 2017 - Posted by Rich Miller
* News-Gazette…
Leaders of Illinois’ public colleges and universities said Tuesday that their institutions can’t withstand further budget cuts and painted a picture of a system already badly damaged.
One president said the state’s higher-education system is approaching the equivalent of “junk-bond status.”
In a two-hour session, the university officials said they had eliminated thousands of positions, instituted furlough days, cut programs and now were assessing whether to undertake extraordinary measures, including eliminating instructional days and perhaps an entire college. […]
Southern Illinois President Randy Dunn said the university is reviewing whether to eliminate academic departments and possibly an entire college.
“If we have to go there, it will be significant and send a tectonic shock through southern Illinois,” he said. “… If you get away from the fiscal analysis, we have a public university system here in Illinois that in the higher education marketplace is just about to go to junk bond status.”
* Daily Egyptian…
SIU President Randy Dunn on Wednesday said SIU cannot operate for another 20 months without state support “short of hollowing out” its core programs. […]
If Illinois does not pass a budget for another 20 months, Dunn said SIU would be forced to gouge the core of its campus programs, services, facilities and regional support projects through another round of budget cuts. He said “the lion’s share” of those reductions would be felt by the Carbondale campus and would go into effect before July 1.
This would come after a “pounding our regular operations have taken,” Dunn wrote in the column.
* Moody’s…
Moody’s has issued a short report (attached) noting the 21-month long budget impasse in the State of Illinois (rated Baa2/negative outlook) is continuing to have negative credit implications for the state’s public universities and community colleges through interrupted state funding for operations. The ongoing budget deadlock is increasingly forcing the state’s public universities to take considerable steps to continue operations and stem the tide of eroding unrestricted liquidity. The state’s community colleges have experienced similar, though less severe, operational and credit pressure.
In the past week, both Northeastern Illinois University (Ba2/negative) and Governors State University (Ba1/negative) announced significant steps to combat the continued absence of state funding for operations. Northeastern Illinois University announced it will eliminate 300 student employee positions and roughly 1,100 university employees will take an unpaid week off during the university’s spring break. The university has also continued hiring and spending freezes from the prior fiscal year. Governors State University announced steps that include the elimination of 22 academic programs and a 15% tuition increase for all undergraduate, graduate and doctoral programs to take effect during the next academic year. In the last two years, the university has eliminated a total of 35 programs and it has cut 62 staff positions in 2016. Material programming reductions and staffing cuts, while necessary to keep the state’s public universities operational in the short-term, will further impair the universities’ abilities to sustain their strategic competitiveness and attract students for the upcoming fall 2017 class.
We believe the state’s public universities will likely take additional steps to mitigate budgetary and liquidity stress while continuing operations. While universities can pull a number of operational levers including academic program elimination, mandatory employee furloughs and reductions in force, these actions will further weaken the universities’ strategic positions. Illinois’ public universities are already coping with continued pressures on enrollment, operations and liquidity. Moreover the budget impasse has also left Illinois universities and colleges with far less MAP (Monetary Award Program) grants than anticipated for the state’s low income students.
The budget impasse has also taken a lesser toll on Illinois community colleges because property taxes are typically the largest revenue source for these schools, followed by tuition and state appropriations. Community college reserves have declined, but remain healthy for the community colleges that we rate. Illinois community colleges can also issue both short-term cash flow notes and long-term working cash bonds to boost liquidity. Despite advantages, many community colleges have made substantial cuts to expenditures or increased tuition to offset reduced state aid distributions that could hurt enrollment and long-term competitiveness. Community colleges also rely on the state for pension contributions, which is a longer term risk for the sector.
Finally, Illinois universities and community colleges remain exposed to demographic challenges that will suppress long-term demand for higher education in the state. Illinois will fare worse than its regional and national peers with decreasing numbers of high school students over the next 15 years, with high school graduates expected to be 14% lower in 2031-32 than 2016-17, compared to 3% lower nationally and 7% lower regionally. Illinois is already a net exporter of high school graduates with net out migration of nearly 17,000 students in fall 2014, the second highest of any state in the country. These demographic challenges add further pressure to the state’s universities, limiting their ability to grow student related revenues to mitigate the impact of state-level issues.
* Related…
* Bernard Schoenburg: Rauner talks up higher ed, but has cut funding
- @MisterJayEm - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:01 am:
Don’t worry Illinois public colleges and universities!
This is all part of Bruce’s plan to tank the state in order to get some sweet, sweet draft picks!
– MrJM
- Anonymous - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:04 am:
Are athletics departments “core programs”? If not, have there been cuts to them at *ANY* of the universities?
- Saluki - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:04 am:
Carbondale teeters on the brink of being a ghost town if this continues. Southern Illinois matters little to most people in this state WITH a strong and vibrant Carbondale and SIUC. Without it, or with a greatly diminished Carbondale, Southern Illinois will be eastern Kentucky. I grieve for my hometown with each passing day, especially knowing that despite the lip service, the current governor sees Higher Education as a dispensable part of state operations.
- Anonymous - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:05 am:
His plan is coming together nicely.
- HigherEdNEIU - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:08 am:
Northeastern has no athletic department and no intercollegiate teams.
- DuPage - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:10 am:
Education is our future. Damaging our universities and community colleges will have a damaging effect on the future of the state. “Job creators” are not going to like what they see.
- wordslinger - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:10 am:
Public universities and community colleges and infrastructure are the foundation upon which you build an economy. They are core state responsibilities.
When you bleed one dry and let the second wither from neglect, any claims that you’re looking to “grow the economy” or “create jobs” are revealed as preposterous lies.
The governor’s reckless actions regqrding his core responsibilities are eroding the foundation so that there will be nothing to build on, especially Downstate.
- Anonymous - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:11 am:
When will Bruce accuse Pat Quinn of wiretapping him?
- Anon - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:11 am:
I’m confident that the governor, like the president, takes no personal responsibility for anything that goes wrong on his watch. It’s all Madigan.
As far as the decline and fall of downstate public universities, I trust downstate voters, who backed Rauner big-league, are satisfied with the results.
- Pot calling kettle - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:12 am:
==Northeastern Illinois University announced it will eliminate 300 student employee positions and roughly 1,100 university employees will take an unpaid week off during the university’s spring break.==
Seems reasonable, right? But remember those Spring Break internships, projects, and other opportunities for students to get “real-world” experience and move forward with projects? Pretty much all of that is cancelled. Sorry students, but the Gov thinks his “turnaround agenda” is more important than your future.
- Pot calling kettle - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:14 am:
==Illinois is already a net exporter of high school graduates with net out migration of nearly 17,000 students in fall 2014, the second highest of any state in the country.==
When the Gov and his lackeys talk about the lack of demand, remember that those 17,000 students are enough to refill EIU, WIU, CSU, & SIU. The demand is there, but we are pushing our students out.
Now, imagine what the #’s for 2016 & 2018 will look like. If you were a HS senior, where would you go?
- My New Handle - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:17 am:
Anger, just anger directed at the governor. His lack of pride in this state and his deliberate destruction of educational institutions is criminal. Rauner wants to destroy rather than build, revels in it. The students and parents who have indebted themselves with tens of thousands of dollars in the hope of better lives for themselves and their children deserve so much more than Mr. Rauner’s (”governor” is no longer a title he desrves) platitudes and lies.
- GraduatedCollegeStudent - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:18 am:
===Are athletics departments “core programs”? If not, have there been cuts to them at *ANY* of the universities? ===
I’m pretty sure some sports have been dropped at some of the schools in the last few years.
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:19 am:
Governors put their names on plaques of buildings on university campuses. Governors tout funding, they brag about how research and facilities are kept at the highest funding possible to generate global impacting research and technologies, and those successes will make the state better.
I’ve yet to hear a Governor say that refusing to fund an entire state’s higher education is the best way to be competitive. I’ve never heard of a state university wrote a letter calming others that it will “stay open” for another year.
These are not accidents.
The Rauner Library and the Rauner Dormatory at Darthmouth are in sharp contrast to Governor Rauner ensuring Eastern Illinois and Chicago State close, just for openers. How about whole colleges in other universities closed? Boarded up university colleges, “That was a college we had here, Governor Rauner refused to fund our university, so we just closed that college”
What about Charleston and Macomb… Carbondale and Edwardsville?
…
… I hear the Rauner Library is really “neat”…
- Compromise requires two sides - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:24 am:
Education is an infrastructure and needs to be treated like one.
Maybe the governor has successfully “turned around” the state. We were starting to see light at the end of the tunnel and he has turned us around and are heading deeper into the abysss
- anonymous- Write “tapp”? Says he doesn’t use a phone
- Jocko - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:31 am:
==SIU cannot operate for another 20 months without state support==
Not to worry, once the National Guard is done staffing AFSCME, they’ll move to teaching undergraduates.
- Anonymous - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:31 am:
===I’m pretty sure some sports have been dropped at some of the schools in the last few years.===
Dropping some sports is not necessarily the same thing as cutting athletics for budgetary reasons. Especially if they are sports that feed off revenue generating Division I sports. Even then, Division I sports don’t generate enough revenues to cover their own operations at any of the state unis except for UIUC.
In other words, they need to cut deeper into non-core functions before they start touching core academics.
Some schools also need to be right-sized and reformed in terms of their aspirations. CSU, NEIU, and GSU being prime examples.
- Stand Tall - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:31 am:
- Pot calling kettle - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:14 am:
==Illinois is already a net exporter of high school graduates with net out migration of nearly 17,000 students in fall 2014, the second highest of any state in the country.==
All this before Rauner was governor and the Democrats had a super majority and were increasing spending on state employee pension and insurance while cutting higher education.
- Rich Miller - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:32 am:
===Some schools also need to be right-sized and reformed===
Then do it in a smart way. Don’t just create a massive fiscal crisis. That’s the dumb way.
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:38 am:
- Stand Tall -
Since 1857, no governor budgeted state universities at a level of zero.
If you advocate that, then Rauner should Stand Tall and decide to close state universities, admitting so behind a podium and in front of cameras.
Why won’t he?
- Old and In the Way - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:40 am:
Let’s not forget to include those local Republican legislators in our criticism! Sure they support their community colleges and universities right up to the point where they have to choose between the governor, and his money, and their community! Shameful. Local voters……wise up!
- Pot calling kettle - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:41 am:
==All this before Rauner was governor and the Democrats had a super majority and were increasing spending on state employee pension and insurance while cutting higher education. ==
So, do you think the Governor’s actions have made this better or worse? There’s an opportunity to enhance higher ed and get those students to come back. Has the Governor made any effort to fix this?
- illini - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:44 am:
@RichMiller - I make very few exceptions to my rule of not commenting to a post known only as “Anonymous”. 25 percent on this post so far today!
Guess they are to busy to “take a half second” to come up with a handle. This is both lazy and unfair to those of us who would like to answer some of these individuals but which Anonymous are we actually talking to?
- Henry Francis - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:50 am:
Rauner threw $49.5M in tax credits for Rivian. And they only have to create 35 jobs to start claiming them. That’s some tough negotiatin’
Priorities
- illini97 - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:52 am:
Let’s dispel this fiction once and for all that Bruce Rauner doesn’t know what he’s doing. He knows exactly what he’s doing; he’s undergoing a systematic effort to change this state and make Illinois more like a his vulture capitalist enterprise.
- Echo The Bunnyman - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 11:06 am:
He may be doing this the dumb way, right sizing some of these universities. But the honest way is about as smart as the previous GA’s and Governors not being responsible either. There’s enough blame to go around. I certainly don’t agree with his approach either.
- Handle Bar Mustache - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 11:14 am:
Rauner has to be the worst governor in America for higher education.
Most state and community college leaders are afraid to say on the record how damaging the Rauner administration has been to them.
They are trying to project confidence and recruit students. They fear retaliation. It is an untenable position for colleges that operate in a very competitive environment.
- New kid - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 11:22 am:
SIU - Carbondale has cut into it’s operations budget for athletics…and it has eliminated men’s and women’s tennis and cut scholarships for swimming. It should be noted that very few state dollars go to athletic programs at SIUC.
- Tommydanger - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 11:26 am:
What percentage of students who go away to college out of state, then stay in that state or otherwise do not return to Illinois?
We are creating a generational brain drain of our best and brightest. Hard to imagine how this will help our state in the long term.
- Mama - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 11:26 am:
Why are the Higher Ed communities still voting for Republicans?
- Mama - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 11:29 am:
The way I see it, Rauner is destroying everything the Dems built.
- lake county democrat - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 11:37 am:
illini97 - if that was a Marco Rubio shout-out, hat-tip!
- AnonymousOne - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 11:40 am:
Quite obviously this governor does not share the same values as the citizens of this state (or most of them). We will continue to lose our best and brightest, prepared by our K-12 schools to other states who do value educated people and offer them jobs. This is willful destruction. Not sure what the end goal here is. Apparently, destroying AFSCME and so everything else is not important?
- Langhorne - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 11:47 am:
Rauner is achingly tiresome. Does he hear himself?
Words-”I want to put more resources into our state university system — Western, Eastern, Southern, ISU, U of I,” Rauner said Wednesday at a rural community economic development conference in downtown Springfield. “They are economic engines in our communities, and I’m going to be advocating with them to help expand their footprint around the state — open branches, open affiliates, make connections in our communities outside of their core campus, so we can create jobs and more educational opportunities … in a dozen, 15, 18, communities around the state.”-
Deeds–no funding at all, or drastically underfunding late. Why? Claims of too much overhead, layers, etc. no data. No actual plan, other than bloodletting.
- Anon - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 11:50 am:
=== Guess they are to busy to “take a half second” to come up with a handle. This is both lazy and unfair to those of us who would like to answer some of these individuals but which Anonymous are we actually talking to? ===
The simple way is to write Anonymous 11:40 a.m. That makes it crystal clear.
- Anonymous - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 12:07 pm:
Northeastern Illinois abandoned its athletic team programs years ago. The sizable field house and athletic fields on campus have been used for health club and high school sports purposes.
Bankrupt Chicago State continues to field athletic teams and award athletic scholarships.
- Sir Reel - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 12:54 pm:
At this level of State support, it’s time to stop calling these “public” universities.
- DuPage - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 1:07 pm:
Some of the Illinois universities and community colleges cutbacks are resulting in fewer class sections. This results in students trying to register and finding available classes already full, delaying their graduation, sometimes a year or even more. Meanwhile Arizona State keeps running ads here. “Save money, take our online FULLY ACCREDITED classes at times convenient to you”. Meanwhile some of our brick and mortar schools are going to be lucky to keep their existing accreditations. Governor Rauner, Arizona thanks you!
- dr. reason a, goodwin - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 1:22 pm:
I wish the voters could really understand what this disembowelment of higher education is doing to the state. It will take years to recover…if ever.
- State Employee - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 1:48 pm:
Rich, this feature on the blog is perfectly timed. I want to thank everyone who has weighed in oh higher ED funding. It helped me to see that my son who is a senior in HS should mostly apply out of state. The last two financial aid award letters cake in from Illinois State & U of I in Springfield. All neighboring states sent us the award letters months ago.
Iowa State offered my son a $7200 grant and with him taking the full amount of loan money ($5500) my out of pocket costs are $19,200. My very own state offered only loans which would make my out of pocket costs for Illinois State $23,500 & U of I (SPI) $19,600. Of course we are going with Iowa State!
Many of the neighboring states prices were about $23,000 so why on earth would any one let their kid attend any of our state universities with all of this funding uncertainty!
- Piece of Work - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 2:45 pm:
State Employee—A parent would let one of their kids attend UIUC because they are one of the top 10 public universities in the nation.
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 2:57 pm:
- State Employee -
It appears - Piece of Work - keeps forgetting the nearly $800 million lost to the U of I System, and the lowering of standards for enterance into UIUC… that and President Killeen himself saying this…
“That’s three-quarters of a billion dollars. That’s a lot,” Killeen told a couple of faculty members lamenting cuts in their units. “We are under huge stress, and Rome is burning around us. These are not normal times”.
You do what you can for your student.
Eyes open.
OW
- PoW - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 3:22 pm:
And still UIUC is a top 10 public university.
Facts are facts!!
- PoW - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 3:24 pm:
There are reasons some schools have to throw money at students to get them to attend.
There are reasons other schools don’t have to and get back to back record freshman enrollments
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 3:26 pm:
===“That’s three-quarters of a billion dollars. That’s a lot,” Killeen told a couple of faculty members lamenting cuts in their units. “We are under huge stress, and Rome is burning around us. These are not normal times.”===
Facts are indeed facts.
The President of the University… That’s who is saying Rome is burning.
Not a stellar way to sell a university, far more expensive than neighboring schools, lowering its entrance requirements and $750 million short in funding… months and moths ago… no end in sight.
Facts are facts, lol
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 3:27 pm:
===There are reasons other schools don’t have to and get back to back record freshman enrollments.===
Lower admission standards.
Again, do I need to pull out the Tribune article, LOL!
- State employee - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 3:57 pm:
@ a peice Rolf work. I know about UIUC because I am alum. We didn’t apply to Champaign Urbana campus we applied to the Springfield campus as indicated in my initial comment. I knew the Springfield campus had cheaper tuition that I could afford. Iowa State is a good school & Iowa funds their public universities. I don’t want to be constantly worried about budget cuts or increasing tuition to offset lack of MAP grants (my son is not eligible for MAP) and cuts in front funding because we don’t have a budget in Illinois.
- PoW - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 3:58 pm:
For grins for all of us Willy, why don’t you post the admission standards for those schools based in Iowa and UIUC.
Thanks in advance
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:04 pm:
- Piece of Work -
Trubune…
http://bit.ly/2lUBq5G
===College coordinator Lianne Musser said those accepted to business and engineering programs were as qualified as those from previous years, but in other programs, “We had maybe a couple that kind of raised eyebrows that they got in,” she said.===
Not the same University… Plus…
Again, you’re “that person”…
The President of the University says… Rome us burning…
… but you know better.
You know.
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:05 pm:
I’m not your Google.
Make your own case.
I’m case you missed me flat out ignoring your ignorance and your ineptitude.
- PoW - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:06 pm:
College of business at UIUC, ACT score between 28-32 or a SAT 1320-1460
University of Iowa school of business ACT 26 and a SAT of 1240
- PoW - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:13 pm:
I’m going to disregard the shots you take at me. You wander into territory that you just shouldn’t.
That’s on you Willy.
You own it bro!
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:20 pm:
- Piece of Work -
Illinois - no state funding for two full years, additionally, $750 million less funding already gone.
Iowa - Fully funded university.
Illinois - 44-310, National Universities
Iowa - 82 310
Illinois - 86 percentile
Iowa - 74 percentile
- Piece of Work -
You are the only one thinking things are great at Illinois.
You are “smarter” than the University President?
For the money, and the lack of money Illinois isn’t receiving in its funding or vining to students to go there, and the lowering of standards of entrance, you are the lone person I could think of that thinks Iowa isn’t a better deal right now that Illinois.
That includes the President.
Is Iowa’s president saying its school is Rome and it’s burning?
But - Piece of Work - you know.
All is well at UIUC, lol
- Anonymous - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:26 pm:
11% graduation rate at Chicago State University. Thirteen consecutive semesters of declining enrollment since the Spring of 2011 (dropping from 7,362 to 3,255).
Wait! Rauner wasn’t in office in 2011! So who really owns this?
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:29 pm:
===Thirtern consecutive semesters of declining enrollment since the Spring of 2011 (dropping from 7,362 to 3,255).
Wait! Rauner wasn’t in office in 2011! So who really owns this?===
Ask yourself this…
“Why won’t Rauner just close it?”
Governors own. That’s why.
What else you got?
- PoW - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:30 pm:
You can cite all those stats but you are building a strawman. I never, ever said things were great at these universities. Likely, most schools across the nation are suffering.
I said, and I will type slow, that a parent should send their kid to UIUC because it is a great university. Many students can’t get in due to the requirements and the competition.
I don’t know what the Iowa school prez is saying and I don’t care. The requirements to attend those schools are lower, and in some cases, much lower.
Keep up
- Anonymous - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:42 pm:
So in Oswego Willy’s World if the ugly State of Illinois Building in Chicago is sold and demolished, its Bruce Rauner’s fault, not James R. Thompson or Helmut Jahn for approving or designing the dump.
What else you got OW?
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:46 pm:
===You can cite all those stats…===
You mean making a case. I did. So there’s that.
===Many students can’t get in due to the requirements and the competition===
That’s changing, lol
===Likely, most schools across the nation are suffering.===
LOL, you mean like three quarter of a billion dollars suffering and no budgetary funding in sight?
It’s not a straw man, it’s a fact.
===I don’t know what the Iowa school prez is saying and I don’t care===
Use the Google, lol
===The requirements to attend those schools are lower, and in some cases, much lower===
… as UIUC lowers theirs to be like… anyone else.
===Keep up===
Got a person who claims ignorance and being inept at searching for facts, how can you even SAY… “Keep up”
#Sad
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:48 pm:
Rauner sells JRTC, Rauner sells JRTC.
How hard is that to understand?
- PoW - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 4:57 pm:
Willy, you’re just killing me with laughter.
UIUC is a great university in spite of what you want to throw out there, most of what is not relevant, to my response–to someone else– that you always feel compelled to answer.
The cute quips and pulling ststs that mean nothing don’t refute the fact that UIUC ranks higher than any university in Iowa and has higher admissions standards. But, a lot of factors go in to where kids go to school.
Go take a trip down I-57 to visit CU and see all those new apartment buildings, new dorms, new administration buildings, new athletic facilities.
You do know where Champaign is, don’t you??
- Anonymous - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 5:06 pm:
===Then do it in a smart way. Don’t just create a massive fiscal crisis. That’s the dumb way.===
Didn’t say fiscal crisis was a solution - but it certainly sheds light on issues to which most voters typically don’t pay attention.
- Anonymous - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 5:08 pm:
I wouldn’t be surprised if the single positive outcome of this administration is an overwhelming “YES” vote on the ballot question of a constitutional convention in 2020.
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 5:11 pm:
===UIUC is a great university in spite of what you want to throw out there.===
Killeen?
===”We are under huge stress, and Rome is burning around us. These are not normal times.”===
Again, you ignore the President of the University… Oh boy.
I get it, you think all is well at UIUC… Facts and the President ain’t strawmen.
Your while comment is a “that person” response…
“Yeah but… I know. I’ve been to UIUC more than any human ever in the history of ever. I know”
Meanwhile, you can’t refute facts or math.
- Anonymous - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 5:17 pm:
A broken watch is correct at least twice each day. Can’t say the same for Oswego Willy.
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 5:19 pm:
I guess when you don’t fund higher education for two years, universities prosper?
Me and Killeen, we’re wrong…
The blind belief that things are fine is astounding.
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 5:45 pm:
The irony of ALL this is…
The thought is I’m running down UIUC and state universities…
Others are arguing either things are “swell” or “shut them down”
Ever wonder why I keep on as I do about this?
Here’s a hint…
If ya keep sayin’ everythin’ is groovy, the best, tops… Why on earth will anyone especially Rauner fund higher education again at the proper levels to prosper.
It’s like a compete lack of the moment.
The state universities and their presidents know it… but snobby alum “UIUC is great” fail to see… the school needs its funding. Continually saying “no changes, we’re still great” ain’t gonna get that funding. That’s not putting pressure on the Governor.
You’re hurting the schools when you’re touring “all is well”…
… today.
Capiche?
- Pot calling kettle - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 5:55 pm:
==UIUC is a great university in spite of what you want to throw out there==
For how much longer? That is the question. Underfund, underfund, no funds, 25% of funds… There is a limit. Fewer students are interested in staying in Illinois. Fewer top students are interested in staying in Illinois.
A college senior looks around. UIUC is a top university, but, Illinois universities are shedding programs and faculty. Is the program or faculty member you were planning to work with going to be there in four years? In two years? Maybe not. Why take that chance? Other top schools offer you a similar deal cost-wise. Why stay?
How long will UIUC be able to stay up there?
- Mama - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 7:22 pm:
== illini97 - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 10:52 am:== “Let’s dispel this fiction once and for all that Bruce Rauner doesn’t know what he’s doing. He knows exactly what he’s doing; he’s undergoing a systematic effort to change this state and make Illinois more like a his vulture capitalist enterprise.”
Change Illinois to what?
- blue dog dem - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 8:25 pm:
I personally don’t think the higher ed haircut has trimmed enough. This is the only thing I can agree with Rauner on.
- Yellow Dog Democrat - Thursday, Mar 9, 17 @ 9:55 pm:
PoW: you are entitled to your opinion. The university president is entitled to his.
Smart parents are not worried about how hard a school is to get in to. They wonder what their child is going to get out of it.
The university president basically said the campus is on fire. I would not send my kid to a campus that was on fire. No matter how hard it was to get in, nor how many others were lined up and waiting.
You wanna send your kids there, great. Heck, you can write a check to the foundation today if you want.
But it’s still your opinion versus the opinion of the CEO of the campus whose job it is to know.
BTW, his key job is fundraising, so university presidents do not ring alarm bells lightly.
- PoW - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 7:36 am:
And after all of that Yellow Dog, UIUC is still rated as a top 10 public university in the US and students are clamoring to go there.
Opinions just don’t trump facts.
- Demoralized - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 7:41 am:
==Opinions just don’t trump facts.==
And yet you are giving an opinion. Stating that students are “clamoring to go there” is an opinion.
==I personally don’t think the higher ed haircut has trimmed enough. This is the only thing I can agree with Rauner on.==
And you think the way it is being done right now is the right way to do it? How it is being done now is NOT how you accomplish that.
- Oswego Willy - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 7:41 am:
===Opinions just don’t trump facts.===
President Killeen?
===“That’s three-quarters of a billion dollars. That’s a lot,” Killeen told a couple of faculty members lamenting cuts in their units. “We are under huge stress, and Rome is burning around us. These are not normal times.”===
You are “that person”
You know more than the University president.
You run faster, you jump higher, you swim farther, you have been to UIUC more than any person ever in the history of people-dom.
You are “that person” who thinks they know, but ignore facts from people, like President Killeen who actually do know.
You are helping in the demise of Higher Education be cause of your snobby ignorance.
- PoW - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 8:24 am:
Demo, when numbers are published for applications, acceptances and denials and record enrollment is listed for the last 2 freshman classes, those are facts, not opinions.
- Oswego Willy - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 8:25 am:
UIUC lowered admission standards.
Those are the facts.
- Demoralized - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 8:26 am:
PoW
Whatever you say. I forgot you are the expert.
- PoW - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 8:29 am:
Enrollment Fall 2016 44880
Fall 2011 42606
Fall 2006 41180
- Oswego Willy - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 8:34 am:
- Demoralized -
You literally are not an expert like - Piece of Work -, President Killeen isn’t an expert like - Piece of Work -, lol
When you lower admission standards, and admit less qualified students, enrollment rises.
- PoW - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 8:39 am:
One school in the Big Ten is ranked ahead of UIUC and that is Michigan. Out of state tuition at Michigan is roughly $43K, at Illinois low $30’s.
Iowa is ranked in the 30’s and has about 33K students. Iowa State is ranked 51.
- Oswego Willy - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 8:46 am:
- Piece of Work -
Northwestern left the B1G? News to Northwestern…
- Oswego Willy - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 8:48 am:
Michigan and Iowa State are fully funded.
- PoW - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 8:53 am:
Now Willy, you should know Northwestern is a private school. You know that right? I listed PUBLIC universities.
- Oswego Willy - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 8:56 am:
===One school in the Big Ten is ranked ahead of UIUC and that is Michigan.===
Reading is fundamental. Where is that word “Public”?
- Oswego Willy - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 8:57 am:
Since we’re talking facts and all.
Further,
So a fully funded UIUC matters not to you? That’s your argument in all this?
- Demoralized - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 9:02 am:
I’d like to get back to the topic at hand. You don’t “reform” higher ed by starving it of funding. You do it with a coherent plan. These enrollment arguments are nice an all but the issue is how universities in Illinois are being harmed by the current budget situation.
- Oswego Willy - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 9:08 am:
===You don’t “reform” higher ed by starving it of funding===
This is a critical point to those who find the non-budgetary funding of higher education “great”, “about time”, or “it won’t matter.”
It fundamentally matters like budgets fundamentally matter as the measuring and the weighing and the monetary commitments towards any and all policies. Deciding that no budgetary monies are allocated for higher education isn’t fundamentally changing anything but the ability to complete any mission, let alone higher education.
===…the issue is how universities in Illinois are being harmed by the current budget situation.===
… as cited by President Killeen. Good points, - Demoralized -
Squeezing the beast isn’t a cohesive plan to change policy but a roughshod hammer destroying anything that it can.
- PoW - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 9:13 am:
Well, I mentioned PUBLIC university at 7:36AM this morning. I’m not going to scroll back to see if it was mentioned previously, I will let you do that.
- illinoised - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 9:18 am:
Disinvestment in higher education is a nail in the coffin for Illinois. Anyone who thinks differently is naive at best.
- Oswego Willy - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 9:20 am:
Public of Private, UIUC is dead last in budgetary funding for its school, which is really about squeezing higher education to crack it.
You are missing the point that everything revolves around, today, right now, the minimum $750+ million the last two years that the U of I system will never fully get back.
That’s last… in budgetary funding.
- illinoised - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 9:21 am:
I hear that sentiment in the town in which I live (we host a university). It is usually included in a conversation which also includes griping about the latest store which has closed. The complainers fail to see the correlation between the two.
- PoW - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 9:31 am:
Ah, when all else fails, when Willy can’t refute facts, he reverts to something else.
That’s okay buddy, we all have off days.
- Oswego Willy - Friday, Mar 10, 17 @ 9:50 am:
- Piece of Work -
UIUC is dead last in budgetary funding.
It’s a fact now. You can’t stay on topic. You know better than Killeen. You’re pathetic except for the blind cheerleading and oblivious to what’s actually at play.
But, like we all see, “you know”