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*** UPDATED x3 *** Lake County GOP gun raffle will proceed as scheduled

Wednesday, Oct 11, 2017

* From a Lake County Republican Party Facebook invite page…

Come out and help protect your second amendment rights and maybe even win a gun. By supporting this event you are helping to support and elect candidates that realize your constitutional rights are not a gift from the government.

We will be starting the night off at 5:30pm with appetizers at 6:00pm.

Dinner will be served at 7:00pm with gun raffle ticket sales being sold from 5:30 until after dinner when the drawings will start.

* The full website is here.

A $2,000 check makes you a “2nd Amendment Sponsor” and gets you 10 dinner tickets, a full-page ad in the program, 10 dinner raffle tickets for a Mossberg shotgun, 6 raffle tickets with the chance to win one of three 22 rifles. You’ll also get a Smith & Wesson M&P 15 SPTII 223…

* These gun raffle fundraisers are pretty common in Downstate counties

Lake County Republicans are moving ahead with a fundraiser where at least a dozen firearms will be given out to donors Friday night, less than two weeks after the deadliest mass shooting in modern U.S. history in Las Vegas. […]

Mark Shaw, the Lake County GOP chairman, said the first-of-its-kind event for local Republicans would proceed as scheduled because it had long been in the planning stages. The Oct. 1 shooting of concertgoers in Las Vegas by a sniper at the Mandalay Bay hotel killed 58 people and wounded hundreds of others.

“Unfortunately, obviously, the tragic events in Las Vegas happened and the fact that we had a dinner scheduled for the 13th of October, that’s been something that’s been in the works for over a year,” Shaw told the Chicago Tribune on Tuesday. […]

“Only the right-wing Republicans would be having something like this at this time. If you truly believe in the 2nd Amendment and that it was a terrible situation in Las Vegas, you probably could easily cancel something and nobody would think bad of you,” said [Sen. Terry Link of Waukegan, the Lake County Democratic chairman], who had been unaware of the fundraiser until asked about it by the Tribune.

A portion of the proceeds will be donated to the Las Vegas Law Enforcement Assistance Fund, according to the Tribune.

* The advertising poster…


*** UPDATE 1 *** The governor has been dodging reporters’ questions on gun control since the Las Vegas shootings. This, however, gives the issue a state angle for reporters to pursue…


*** UPDATE 2 ***  More fodder for Rauner questions…

Earlier today, State Representative Scott Drury (D-Highwood) introduced legislation to ban the sale, manufacture, possession, transfer or importation of bump stock devices – firearm equipment that essentially converts a semi-automatic weapon into a machine gun. The shooter responsible for the recent devastation in Las Vegas, Nevada used bump stock devices to fire his ammunition at a much more rapid pace than would otherwise have been possible. The devices allow a shooter to increase his firing rate from between 45 and 60 rounds per minute to between 400 and 800 rounds per minute.
“Machine guns are illegal in Illinois,” said Drury. “Common sense dictates that a device that essentially converts firearms into machine guns should also be illegal.”
Since the Las Vegas massacre, there have been bi-partisan calls for a ban on bump stock devices. Drury says his proposal answers those calls. According to Drury, he intentionally limited the scope of the proposed legislation to bump stock devices to allow the public to see which legislators truly support a bump stock ban. “There is nowhere to hide,” said Drury.
Drury has long advocated for more responsible gun laws, and currently is a co-sponsor of legislation requiring the licensing of gun dealers. In 2013, Drury successfully raced to make sure towns throughout a major part of his legislative district imposed assault weapons bans and regulations notwithstanding an NRA-backed law that sought to eliminate towns’ abilities to exercise local control on the issue. “The NRA’s legislation gave towns 10 days to implement assault bans or forever lose the right,” said Drury. “In that short timeframe, we accomplished what the NRA thought would be impossible – we acted quickly and won, preserving local control in the process.”
Drury says it is again time to act swiftly. “Illinois has the opportunity to take the lead on a national issue of critical importance and help save lives.”
Drury’s legislation is House Bill 4112.

*** UPDATE 3 *** This was sent a couple of hours ago, but I never got it…

In the wake of the deadliest mass shooting in American history, Lake County Republicans are moving forward with a party fundraiser that hopes to draw crowds by raffling off a host of firearms. But Bruce Rauner has been silent on his own party’s controversial fundraising tactic.

If history is any indication, Rauner will likely have nothing to say. Two days ago, Rauner refused to speak out about mass shootings, saying he has “no obligation to comment” on national issues. Last week, Rauner dodged reporters’ questions for days on his position on gun legislation and what he would do to keep Illinoisans safe.

“While Bruce Rauner refuses to tell Illinoisans how he will prevent mass shootings in our state, his party is raffling off guns just weeks after the tragedy in Las Vegas,” said Pritzker campaign spokeswoman Jordan Abudayyeh. “This is a shameful insult to American families still mourning and should be immediately condemned by Rauner, the top Republican in our state.”

- Posted by Rich Miller        

96 Comments »
  1. - Collinsville Kevin - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:40 am:

    God, guns and gays. The GOP mantra.


  2. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:40 am:

    Ghoulish


  3. - 360 Degree TurnAround - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:43 am:

    We can’t talk about gun control after a mass shooting. It is always premature. But we can have a gun giveaway.


  4. - Perrid - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:47 am:

    Obviously it means that they want to level the playing field with regards to force between “good” people and the criminals/government. With Dirty Harry on the poster they are probably pushing more on the criminal side, but I always find it funny how, when gun nuts talk about needing to be able to fight the government if it gets oppressive, they are talking about shooting and killing police officers or members of the military. They can’t use those words, but advocating for a militia means advocating for the right to kill cops if you feel like it - if you are “oppressed” which is of course subjective. That’s simple logic.


  5. - wordslinger - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:47 am:

    I think “leveling the playing field” means these “tools” should be used for the express purpose they were designed for.


  6. - Toast - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:49 am:

    The pearl-clutching is priceless.


  7. - 47th Ward - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:50 am:

    As a governing majority, all the Republicans offer is tax cuts and guns.


  8. - Deplorable - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:52 am:

    Leveling the playing field means your granny can defend herself against a thug.

    You’re welcome.


  9. - @MisterJayEm - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:57 am:

    “your granny can defend herself against a thug.”

    Seems they were right about ‘Rule 34 of the Internet’.

    – MrJM


  10. - A guy - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:57 am:

    This is one issue where I truly believe the opponents on each side truly enjoy and relish in antagonizing one another.

    This issue is settled for people one way or the other, and the opposite sides just don’t care what the other side thinks. It’s just loud.


  11. - Mongo - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:57 am:

    Talk about tone-deaf. Perrid makes a good point too…who are the “militia” supposed to shoot at? None other than local law enforcement, National Guard, and heck, throw in some local elected officials too.

    I’d love to see a comment from the Illinois Association of Chiefs of Police, or the Lake County Sheriff.


  12. - Blue dog dem - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:58 am:

    How do I get some of these tickets?


  13. - King Louis XVI - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 10:59 am:

    –your granny can defend herself against a thug.–

    Thug? You mean 64-year old, white, millionaire types?


  14. - Mongo - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:00 am:

    Deplorable, you are kidding, right? I missed the s/


  15. - Jocko - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:01 am:

    So “a well regulated militia” means dinner and raffle tickets…got it.


  16. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:05 am:

    I dont see why this is news? If there was a recent, tragic drunk driving collision and they were raffling off a pricey bottle of wine, nobody would accuse the partipants of advocating for drunk driving. They are raffling off a very common, modern rifle that millions of people own and use for lawful purposes.


  17. - Graduated College Student - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:05 am:

    The playing field was permanently and decisively unleveled in 1945.


  18. - Just Sayin' - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:06 am:

    —”…elect candidates that realize your constitutional rights are not a gift from the government” —-

    Hmmmm, life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness are the only unalienable rights “endowed by [the] Creator” in our founding documents. The Constitution and its amendments (including gun rights) are by definition the rights the government gives us. LOL.


  19. - Stones - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:07 am:

    It’s the Archie Bunker solution to end all hijackings - arm all your passengers.


  20. - don the legend - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:07 am:

    I wonder if they will start the event with a prayer?


  21. - Toast - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:08 am:

    ## Thug? You mean 64-year old, white, millionaire types? ##

    A thug is a thug, are you equating that with race?


  22. - PJ - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:09 am:

    You have to love donating part of the proceeds to Las Vegas. Maybe they can keep a further 10% of the proceeds in a rainy day pool to donate to the next mass shooting the guns they’re giving away are used in.

    Make sure to keep the future victims in your thoughts and prayers!


  23. - cdog - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:10 am:

    What’s wrong with having a gun, to use defensively, for whatever reason?

    You like “bread and circus.” I prefer food, water, and guns.


  24. - Anon221 - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:10 am:

    “Mark Shaw, the Lake County GOP chairman, said the first-of-its-kind event for local Republicans would proceed as scheduled because it had long been in the planning stages.”

    Long been in the planning stages… but someone in the LCGOP had decided that this first-of-its-kind event was actually a good idea. Sitting around, raffling off guns on Friday the 13th to level the playing field. This is all about the money. It has nothing to do with 2nd Amendment rights. And giving a “sizable amount of money” doesn’t take the stain away from that greed.


  25. - Grand Avenue - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:13 am:

    Also interesting - the website for the event offers “Joe Walsh Volunteer Discounted Dinner Tickets”

    Subscribers know why that’s extra interesting


  26. - We'll See - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:14 am:

    Well…. you can’t spell pogo without GOP.


  27. - blue dog dem - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:14 am:

    It scares me that so many think so little of the power of prayeR. That’s ok. Its equally frightening to me that so many think govt is the answer to all.that’s ok too. Let’s make a deal. You let me pray and I will let you think MJM can fix this states problems(Rauner as well).


  28. - wordslinger - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:15 am:

    – How do I get some of these tickets–

    Maybe if you think and pray on it, and the answer will come to you.

    Or try the google.


  29. - Grand Avenue - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:15 am:

    Overall though, this would appear to turn off the same people Rauner was trying to appeal to when he signed HB40 - Suburban women (the lady in the picture notwithstanding).


  30. - Arsenal - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:16 am:

    Probably not absolute box office poison in the state, not even in all of the suburbs, but Lake County kinda seems like one of the places that would be a bit squeamish about this.


  31. - Just Observing - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:17 am:

    I wonder if the Lake County GOP could have legally even changed out the prize if they wanted to. They (at least should have) obtained a raffle license from the state and declared what the prize would have been — they likely also had publicized rules as well — I just don’t know if they could have legally switch out the prize after tickets began selling unless the rules detailed that they have the right to change-up the prize.


  32. - MG85 - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:17 am:

    ==What’s wrong with having a gun, to use defensively, for whatever reason?==

    Well which is it that you are asking, the wrongness of having a gun for defense or for whatever reason?

    Having “a gun” for defense is much different than for whatever reason.

    Also, the definition of a gun is pretty broad. Many different types. Most sensible folks don’t believe any gun should be available for any reason. The argument goes, a few guns for a limited types of people for specific, non-threatening to the public, reasons.


  33. - Last Bull Moose - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:18 am:

    The people who wrote the Constitution and the Bill of Rights had fought and won a revolution. They thought that government was necessary but dangerous. Checks and balances within the system were to protect against tyranny.So was the threat of an armed citizenry.

    We are a vastly different society today. The Second Amendment may be outdated, like our treating of Indian tribes as sovereign nations. I don’t see a way to change either.


  34. - ZC - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:20 am:

    It was a Highland Park resident (a pediatrician, no less) who tried to get the Supreme Court just two years ago to declare that there is a constitutional 2nd amendment right for all American citizens to own semi-automatic weapons.

    That will not fly as long as Anthony Kennedy is on the Supreme Court, but give Trump 1-2 more appointments, who knows.


  35. - cdog - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:21 am:

    MG85, sorry about the sentence structure error which muddles my point.

    I support defensive philosophies of gun ownership. I’m not a big fan of offensive use of guns for armed robbery, armed assault, etc. :)


  36. - Grand Avenue - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:21 am:

    How do these work - do you need to pass a background check to buy the raffle tickets or do they run the check after you win or what?


  37. - cdog - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:24 am:

    ZC, but in a certain “defensive use thought experiment,” a semi-automatic may be necessary depending on what one is defending oneself against. Correct?

    That is what is on the mind of the owners of these weapons.


  38. - Blue dog dem - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:25 am:

    By the way. I think these gun raffles are rigged…..I never win


  39. - wordslinger - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:25 am:

    Well, BDD, I think a flippant “thoughts and prayers” after every massacre is blasphemous and as meaningful as saying “geusendtheit” when someone sneezes.


  40. - Ghost - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:26 am:

    let me see if I understand the GOP position…. abortion is wrong because it takes a life (a life that should not habe medical care, education or care from tax dollars)…. but guns should be given away and supported for their intended use to take a life…. So is the GOP pro life or not? Would abortions be ok if the Dr uses an AR15 or 1911 .45?


  41. - MG85 - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:26 am:

    @Cdog

    Ok, but against who, when, and where? And using what?

    Any military type will tell you that a rifle, whether it be auto or semi, is actually not what you want to use for home protection. It’s maximum effective range makes it too deadly for those you may not intend to shoot besides the perpetrator (wife in another room, child in bedroom, neighbor in another house, etc). A shotgun, however, is much preferred due to its quick disbursement of round and immediate intimidation factor when loading a round.

    I know of very few serious people who want to outlaw shotguns. So my question to you is, what’s wrong with outlawing guns outside of this category for the safety of our society?


  42. - Toast - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:27 am:

    same rules as a purchase, FOID, background check, waiting period. A waiting period makes no sense at a raffle, but it is what it is.


  43. - We'll See - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:31 am:

    “…proceed as scheduled because it had long been in the planning stages.”

    Lessons from the Donner Party have not reached Lake County.


  44. - PJ - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:33 am:

    ===What’s wrong with having a gun, to use defensively, for whatever reason?===

    Nothing. The problem is that your ability to buy guns to use against home invaders also allows people to buy them for mass shootings. That’s especially true when the gun you’re buying for defense is a rifle originally manufactured for killing enemy soldiers on a battlefield. A shotgun can pretty effectively defend your home without hitting hundreds from a hotel window. This isn’t that hard to understand, I don’t think.

    ===It scares me that so many think so little of the power of prayeR.===

    No one is belittling prayer. We’re belittling the notion that all we can do about mass shootings is pray for the victims. There are public policy solutions to this problem, or at least ways to mitigate it. If all you want to do is pray for the victims, fine. But understand that in two months, you’re going to be praying for several dozen more. And several dozen more after that. God didn’t give us hands, legs, and a brain so that we could solve all our problems simply by asking they be solved.


  45. - don the legend - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:35 am:

    Blue Dog. I was not addressing the many previous offers of “thoughts and prayers”.

    I meant to have people think of the possible irony of all the fine folks of Lake County opening a meeting with a prayer and then proceeding to give a away guns that some would say serve one purpose only.
    With respect.


  46. - Mason born - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:37 am:

    Grand Avenue

    They work like this, the firearm is kept in the inventory of the liscensed FFL dealer until a winner is drawn, at that point the winber fills out the paperwork just as if he/she had bought the gun from the FFL dealer. So background check, foid, waiting period, etc. There is a disclaimer on the ticket stating that winner must be eligible to purchase/own the firearm if you buy a ticket & aren’t eligible they’ll redraw.

    I’ve never won one but walked my dad through it for a USMC vets raffle.


  47. - A guy - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:37 am:

    == but Lake County kinda seems like one of the places that would be a bit squeamish about this.==

    You’re kidding, right?


  48. - Blue dog dem - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:38 am:

    Word. Some things flippant to you may be extremely important to someone else.


  49. - Blue dog dem - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:40 am:

    Don. I understand. Thanks for your civility.


  50. - Actual Red - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:44 am:

    I support the right to own guns (as long as they are reasonably regulated and distributed) but the right’s rhetoric around them is so disjointed.

    I just don’t see you can say
    “We need guns to protect us from the government”
    with a straight face, while also saying
    “Those football players shouldn’t stand during the national anthem, it’s disrespectful to the military”
    and
    “Black Lives Matter is all about violence against police! It’s a terrorist organization!”
    and
    “If you don’t love this country, then leave”

    Which is it? Do we hate and distrust the government enough to want to ensure we can violently overthrow it by defeating the police and military in combat? Or do we love the government, police, and military so much that daring to silently kneel during the national anthem or chant anti-police slogans is disgusting and unthinkable? How are you going to have it both ways?


  51. - We'll See - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 11:50 am:

    Given the timing of the raffle/dinner and the plans to proceed, they should have updated to poster to Charlton (the rug) Heston with the “From my cold dead hands” quote.


  52. - paddyrollingstone - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 12:07 pm:

    I agree with A guy

    “This is one issue where I truly believe the opponents on each side truly enjoy and relish in antagonizing one another.

    This issue is settled for people one way or the other, and the opposite sides just don’t care what the other side thinks. It’s just loud.”

    I believe in the right to own guns but think (like a lot of people) that there should be some restrictions. I am also aware that there are well thought-out opinions on both sides and that these are unlikely to change really no matter what happens.

    After the Las Vegas shooting, I remarked to my wife that I thought little was going to change. This deeply distressed her but I felt that it was the truth.

    The Lake County GOP raffle, however, seems to be a bad idea just on political reasons alone. Someone will at some point (hopefully) get the Governor to comment on it and it will only hurt him. Raffles like this make the hard core gun rights supporters happy but kind of baffle most others.


  53. - WTF - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 12:20 pm:

    ==Some things flippant to you may be extremely important to someone else.==

    And depending on where you sit, “someone else” is either “righteously indignant” or “a snowflake”

    Crazy world


  54. - Cheryl44 - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 12:26 pm:

    Thanks, Mason, I was wondering that too.


  55. - Michelle Flaherty - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 12:27 pm:

    After dabbling in child porn, the Lake Country Republicans needed a new direction … dealing in assault weapons.

    http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2009-07-03/news/0907010521_1_child-pornography-child-porn-case-adams


  56. - Southside Markie - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 12:28 pm:

    Doesn’t appear that the organization qualifies for a raffle license. Sec. 2(b) of the Raffles and Poker Runs Act limits which organizations can get raffle licenses: “Raffle licenses shall be issued only to bona fide religious, charitable, labor, business, fraternal, educational or veterans’ organizations that operate without profit to their members and which have been in existence continuously for a period of 5 years immediately before making application for a raffle license and which have had during that entire 5-year period a bona fide membership engaged in carrying out their objects, or to a non-profit fundraising organization that the licensing authority determines is organized for the sole purpose of providing financial assistance to an identified individual or group of individuals suffering extreme financial hardship as the result of an illness, disability, accident or disaster, as well as law enforcement agencies and statewide associations that represent law enforcement officials as provided for in Section 9 of this Act.”


  57. - Mason born - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 12:41 pm:

    Cheryl

    No problem.


  58. - Texas Red - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:03 pm:

    California Democratic Sen. Dianne Feinstein said in an interview on CBS’s ‘Face The Nation’ this week that she can think of no law that Congress could pass which would have prevented last week’s Las Vegas mass shooting.


  59. - Toast - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:12 pm:

    ## Hmmmm, life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness are the only unalienable rights “endowed by [the] Creator” in our founding documents. The Constitution and its amendments (including gun rights) are by definition the rights the government gives us. LOL.##

    Mmmm, no. Wrong. Dead wrong. the bill of rights has always been considered a check on government power. Using your logic, only government approved speach would be allowed.


  60. - Just Observing - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:15 pm:

    === It was a Highland Park resident (a pediatrician, no less) who tried to get the Supreme Court just two years ago to declare that there is a constitutional 2nd amendment right for all American citizens to own semi-automatic weapons. ===

    I don’t think you, like most people clamoring to prohibit semi-automatic guns, know what a semi-automatic gun is. Nearly every gun on the market is semi-automatic. To call for a prohibition of semi-automatic weapons is to call for a repeal of the second amendment.


  61. - Rod - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:19 pm:

    To the question posed by IL working together. What does “levelling the playing field” even mean? It means arming those who are potential victims of crime from illegally armed criminals. It also means if necessary defending ourselves with arms. It is a rather simple concept really, one that the Supreme Court in the District of Columbia v. Heller made more clear in that the Second Amendment is an individual right intimately tied to the natural right of self-defense.


  62. - California Guy - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:25 pm:

    Dems are missing the mark big time on the gun issue. Go drive to a gun club/shooting range parking lot. It’s old pick-up trucks, muddy Jeeps, and old cars that are barely running. Gun owners, who are largely “working class” tradesman, see rich people surrounded by security advocating for the removal of protections (guns) from regular working people. That’s the wedge issue that the NRA has taken full advantage of to the benefit of the Republican party.

    Drury’s plan might sell in ritzy Highland Park, but it’s a loser outside the North Shore.


  63. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:28 pm:

    @Blue dog
    Agree, some on the left like to ridicule religion and prayers. That might have something to do why they are presently in the minority in Washington and why they couldn’t even beat a loony like Trump.
    As far as the “leveling the playing field” comment goes. The attitude of the gun rights folks is that the criminals will always have a gun available to commit their crimes, the good guys better have theirs too.


  64. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:28 pm:

    = I wonder if they will start the event with a prayer? =

    If you don’t want to stand for the prayer, feel free to take a knee.


  65. - paddyrollingstone - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:34 pm:

    Anon - I suppose there are some on the left who like to ridicule religion and prayers. I personally don’t know of anyone who does, though. I am a pretty committed Catholic and my view of the congressmen who refused to participate in the moment of silence or who ridiculed the “cut and paste” comments about the victims being in our thoughts and prayers, were merely making the point that such words can seem hollow when followed by inaction.


  66. - Just Sayin' - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:39 pm:

    —-”Using your logic, only government approved speach would be allowed.”—-

    Toast: Uh, no. My logic states those rights have been given by the founding government and could be taken away (e.g. Constitutional amendment) unlike unalienable rights. They, like free speech, are a gift of our founding government. Even some first-world countries do not have the expansive rights given in our Bill of Rights.


  67. - Catholic School Teacher - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:41 pm:

    I’d be more embarrassed they used the British spelling “levelling”.


  68. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:44 pm:

    Mongo- “I’d love to see a comment from the Illinois Association of Chiefs of Police, or the Lake County Sheriff.”

    You are way overestimating the I.Q. level of NRA members. They still have not figured out that their hero Rep. Brandon Phelps and NRA lobbyist Todd Vandermyde sold them out to police unions in the 2013 concealed carry bill, which was practically written by the anti-gun IL Chiefs, who opposed any form of citizen carry for at least forty years.

    These people are cop buffs, that’s why they idolize Dirty Harry. They want to be cops, and truly believe, “the police are on our side” even after Philando Castile gets executed on live Facebook. That will never happen to them, they are “the good guys.”

    Think in a simplistic 7th grade boys school mentality and you will understand why they didn’t cancel the raffle. That would require a sense of self-reflection.


  69. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:44 pm:

    = You have to love donating part of the proceeds to Las Vegas. =

    I wonder how much the Lake County Democrats are sending?


  70. - cdog - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:57 pm:

    There is an interesting caveat to the current anti-automatic weapon sentiments.

    The two rifles displayed as being used on the Las Vegas crowd had two modifications — bump stocks and bipod legs. These are mutually exclusive as a bumpstock uses the recoil to accelerate the firing. This recoil automation is not available when attached to a bipod.

    It’s a little weird, isn’t it?

    I’d like to see enforcement of the laws that say crazy people need to turn in their guns.


  71. - Hickory - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 1:58 pm:

    For all of you gun haters, I suggest that you go to a shooting range and see that some individuals enjoy shooting. I’m sure one of the good old boys or girls will loan you a gun, if you have a FOID card, and let you shoot. Try it, you may like it.


  72. - Rich Miller - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 2:01 pm:

    ===loan you a gun, if you have a FOID card===

    You don’t need a FOID to shoot at a gun range as long as you’re in the same firing lane with someone who does have a FOID.


  73. - Toast - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 2:01 pm:

    ## They, like free speech, are a gift of our founding government ##

    One can only hope that very few people have the same warped view of our Constitution.


  74. - Rich Miller - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 2:06 pm:

    === This recoil automation is not available when attached to a bipod. ===

    He apparently had explosive bullets and was trying to shoot those at a big gas tanker.


  75. - Highspeed - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 2:07 pm:

    My firearms must be defective, cause they haven’t caused anybody any harm since I’ve owned them.


  76. - m - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 2:08 pm:

    California guy gets it. “Dems are missing the mark big time on the gun issue. Go drive to a gun club/shooting range parking lot. It’s old pick-up trucks, muddy Jeeps, and old cars that are barely running. Gun owners, who are largely “working class” tradesman, see rich people surrounded by security advocating for the removal of protections (guns) from regular working people. That’s the wedge issue that the NRA has taken full advantage of to the benefit of the Republican party.”

    Want to go find a big group of gun owners, head to a union meeting. No one seems to notice that in Illinois, despite this being a “GOP or right-wing” issue, the NRA”s perennial guy in the GA has been a democrat, and their lobbyist also represents unions. They’ve been splitting their base on this issue and it is only getting worse.

    It’s ok to surround the president, the lawmakers at the capitol, the tellers at a bank, a money truck, etc. with guns to protect them because it seems like the best way to do it and it’s soooo important to protect THOSE things. But for people with lower incomes, they can’t afford security guards, so they have guns or nothing. And any suggesting of protecting public school children with guns is just ludicrous, despite the fact that so many Congressmen, etc. send their kids to schools that are basically forts with armed guards.

    “My ivory tower needs guns, but the trailer park doesn’t.” That’s a great way to win over the working class.


  77. - Groundhog Day - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 2:15 pm:

    Because, why not?/s


  78. - m - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 2:16 pm:

    And yes, anti-union pro-gun Republicans have been doing the same thing from the opposite direction.


  79. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 2:18 pm:

    I would love to see 10 Chicago “gang” members buy a table and show up to this event.


  80. - Steve Rogers - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 2:27 pm:

    Sigh. Of course there is nothing wrong with owning guns. And no one is saying ALL guns should be banned. Both sides believe in some form of gun control–even Justice Scalia in Heller noted that guns can be regulated. The issue is where is the line that separates the two sides? Should pistols be regulated? revolvers? Shotguns? AR-15s? Bazookas? Surface-to-air missiles? atomic bombs? You’d think, according to the NRA and other 2nd amendment rights groups, I can own an atomic bomb. After all, I’m just defending myself.


  81. - Rich Miller - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 2:56 pm:

    ===Go drive to a gun club/shooting range parking lot. It’s old pick-up trucks, muddy Jeeps, and old cars that are barely running===

    It’s not a cheap hobby. The gun range I frequent usually has pretty nice cars and trucks in its lot. http://siddensgunrange.com/


  82. - m - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 2:57 pm:

    “He apparently had explosive bullets and was trying to shoot those at a big gas tanker.”

    That’s the first I heard of him using explosive bullets and I couldn’t find anything on Google either. I’ve never seen .223 explosive bullets, but that certainly doesn’t mean that they can’t exist.


  83. - Rich Miller - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 3:02 pm:

    ===I couldn’t find anything on Google either===

    Was on CNN or MSNBC last night as part of coverage of the sheriff’s presser.


  84. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 3:21 pm:

    Incendiary bullets.


  85. - golface18 - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 3:24 pm:

    m - I believe I read that he also had .308 rifles in his room and I believe that caliber does have Incendiary bullets. also, I believe 30-06 do also.


  86. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 3:30 pm:

    = I can own an atomic bomb. After all, I’m just defending myself. =

    You’re being silly now. How would you defend yourself, by placing your atomic bomb in front of the incoming one?


  87. - FormerParatrooper - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 3:41 pm:

    I think they were calling tracer rounds exploding bullets. I do know, from personal experience, that firing a standard tracer round into a container of gasoline does not ignite the gas. This was demonstrated in a controlled environment on a military demo range to dispel some beliefs of the junior and some senior ranks that shooting fuel tanks would cause explosions. As I remember we tried aviation fuel, regular gasoline and racing fuel. Think we fired at least 50 tracer rounds in semi and auto modes. What did create an explosion and fireball was the addition of an explosive charge on the fuel container.

    Incendiary rounds are different from tracer, and with the changes and conflicting information on this case, who really knows what he had.


  88. - Arsenal - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 3:45 pm:

    ==You’re kidding, right?==

    Not really. Lake County is certainly willing to vote for pro-gun control politicians, so it seems to me that it has some misgivings about firearms.


  89. - Rich Miller - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 3:48 pm:

    ===I think they were calling tracer rounds exploding bullets===

    Nope. There was a distinction made.


  90. - Steve Rogers - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 3:50 pm:

    Anonymous: Of course I’m being silly, that’s the point!


  91. - FormerParatrooper - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 4:06 pm:

    Since they made that distinction, we will have to wait to see what they say later about the matter. All I know for sure is they are fueling the conspiracy crowds on the left and right with some of the conflicting information they have given and the changes in time lines.


  92. - Demoralized - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 4:42 pm:

    I’ve never understood this “protect our 2nd Amendment rights” mantra. Who is trying to take them away from you?

    I don’t oppose necessarily a gun raffle. But going forward with this at this moment is just tone deafness.


  93. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 4:42 pm:

    ==It’s not a cheap hobby. The gun range I frequent usually has pretty nice cars and trucks in its lot. http://siddensgunrange.com/==

    Never said it was a cheap hobby. Most of the gun enthusiasts that I know spend money they don’t have on accessories for their rifles. Overall point I was making is that dems are alienating a big voting block that could swing their way but for the gun issue. Gun owners see the gun control issue as an elitist rich people vs ordinary people situation.

    Guys like Bernie Sanders and Joe Manchin did (and continue) to do well in their states with blue collar people because they understand the complexity of the issue. Sanders only recently got loud about gun control after debating Clinton - who consistently pointed out his “pro-gun” record just before she lost the blue collar vote in the Midwest. Point being: gun control is a political loser for dems.


  94. - Toast - Wednesday, Oct 11, 17 @ 8:12 pm:

    ** Who is trying to take them away from you? **

    http://ilga.gov/legislation/billstatus.asp?DocNum=4107&GAID=14&GA=100&DocTypeID=HB&LegID=107988&SessionID=91


  95. - Demoralized - Thursday, Oct 12, 17 @ 9:13 am:

    Toast:

    Those are specific things that reasonable people can discuss. Nobody is trying to take your guns away.


  96. - Toast - Thursday, Oct 12, 17 @ 9:28 am:

    This bill says otherwise, regardless of what “reasonable people” wish to discuss:

    Makes it unlawful for any person to knowingly possess an assault weapon, .50 caliber rifle, or .50 caliber cartridge 300 days after the effective date of this amendatory Act, except possession of weapons registered with the State Police in the time provided


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