41 Comments - Philly H. - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:11 pm: Wait, Terry Cosgrove is operating in an intellectually dishonest manner? That never happens. - Anyone Remember - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:11 pm: Tip ‘o the hat to Terry Cosgrove for reminding us that they’re not just coming for abortion, as they’re also trying to outlaw birth control for everyone, including married couples. - TheInvisibleMan - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:19 pm: ==they’re also trying to outlaw birth control for everyone, including married couples== Well, that was the de facto situation prior to the 1965 case of Griswold v Connecticut. It was illegal to distribute contraception. Including to married couples. You say that as a joke, but it is not a joke. The religious right is working very hard to overturn supreme court decisions in this arena. The poster child is Roe v. Wade, but you better pay attention to the bigger picture - because they are. - read first - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:29 pm: What they’re proposing is similar to laws passed around the country. A fetal heartbeat can be detected around 6 weeks of gestation. However, a fetal heartbeat does not indicate viability. Many women, myself included, have had the heart wrenching experience of hearing a heartbeat only to learn 5 seconds later that there’s a problem with the fetus or the pregnancy. - TrumpsSmallHands - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:35 pm: ==they’re also trying to outlaw birth control for everyone, including married couples== Since the basis for Roe v. Wade is the right to privacy established in Griswold v. Connecticuta reversal of Roe would certainly weaken the precedent in Griswold. I don’t think it is a stretch to say that if Roe falls some states may attack birth control. I think they are more likely to go after Obergefell v. Hodges (Same Sex Marriage) and maybe even Lawrence v. Texas (the right to engage in same-sex relations) first though. Cosgrove isn’t really wrong about right-wing attacks on privacy rights (birth control, abortion, same-sex marriage) nationally. - DIstant watcher - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:35 pm: It’s not his style, but Terry should send them some flowers or chocolates or something. This bill is to Terry what helmet laws were to ABATE. - Downstate Illinois - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:40 pm: Nothing like a good lie to activate the donor base. No one is trying to make birth control illegal. One side of this argument is standing for human rights. The other side isn’t. - Rich Miller - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:41 pm: ===No one is trying to make birth control illegal=== See some of the above comments. - Huh? - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:43 pm: Thank god for the democratic super majorities on the GA. This bill will never see the light of day - Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:45 pm: ===State Representatives Allen Skillicorn (R-Crystal Lake), Bard Halbrook (R-Shelbyville), Amy Grant (R-Wheaton), and Chris Miller (R-Oakland) are calling for the repeal.=== The comedy that *is* the HGOP continues to think they can “teach”… and they’ve learned nothing about politics or the electorate. The devolving of the Raunerites to Eastern Bloc folks, to the panderers of the few, the base… pretty soon what is left of the “ILGOP” will be 7-8 old, white, angry folks at the end of a bar yelling they can’t hear “Jeopardy” on the TV. Maybe the HGOP can get below 40 members yet. - Grandson of Man - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:50 pm: “Wait, Terry Cosgrove is operating in an intellectually dishonest manner? That never happens.” Who made a bill that has less than zero chance of passing? Dishonesty is pandering to angry right wing voters when knowing the bill is beyond dead on arrival (see also Eastern Bloc Chicago separation from Illinois). - Pot calling kettle - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:51 pm: I will believe they are serious about the sanctity of all life, no exceptions, when they also file bills to curb gun ownership and restrict the use of guns for personal protection. These folks seem to trust pretty much anyone to take a life on the spur of the moment if it is with a gun. But, a woman and her doctor are not given any latitude whatsoever. Also, does the bill include financial support for prenatal care? How about support for the child and mother for the next 18 years? Paid maternity leave? I bring these up because having a baby alters a woman’s life in uncounted ways. It impacts her education and career. If you want more women to “choose life,” remove the barriers that might prevent her from doing so. - Words Words Words - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:57 pm: It’s interesting that what jumps out people from this post is so very different depending on where readers stand on abortion. My immediate reaction was, “But…that’s not what the word ‘viability ‘means.” Commenters above judged Cosgrove’s comments as intellectually dishonest, despite evidence that there’s reasonable basis for them. Meanwhile, the sponsors of this bill are literally telling us that a word doesn’t mean what it means. I trust that their intent is founded in sincere belief, and I know that this term is getting tossed around a lot, but the approach does strike me as a little Orwellian. - Central bloc - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 3:58 pm: ** lso, does the bill include financial support for prenatal care? How about support for the child and mother for the next 18 years? Paid maternity leave? I bring these up because having a baby alters a woman’s life in uncounted ways. It impacts her education and career. If you want more women to “choose life,” remove the barriers that might prevent her from doing so. ** Those things are the responsibility of the parents, end of story. Your gun comments are hyperbole. - Words Words Words - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:04 pm: It’s interesting that what jumps out people from this post is so very different depending on where readers stand on abortion. My immediate reaction was, “But…that’s not what the word ‘viability ‘means.” Commenters above judged Cosgrove’s fundraising message as intellectually dishonest, despite evidence that there’s reasonable basis for them. Meanwhile, the sponsors of this bill are literally telling us that a word doesn’t mean what it means. I trust that their intent is founded in sincere belief, and I know that this term is getting tossed around a lot, but the approach does strike me as a little Orwellian. - Philly H. - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:09 pm: == they’re also trying to outlaw birth control for everyone, including married couples. == I have no doubt that there are some wacky, hard-right ideas out there on the fringe. But is there an actual bill filed somewhere calling for outlawing birth control for married couples? If not, that statement is a bit hyperbolic. - Cosgrove - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:10 pm: For the past 46 years, very few people took the threats to Roe seriously, resulting in where we are in 2019 with its demise imminent. “No one is trying to make birth control illegal” Really? No one except the right-wingers who want the law to say that “life begins” at their magic and unscientific moment of conception which would outlaw nearly all forms of the birth control pill and the IUD. Then you have all the lies about women who have an abortion and even more lies about birth control. Welcome to the U.S. and Illinois in 2019. - Jibba - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:14 pm: ==Those things are the responsibility of the parents, end of story=== Pretty harsh world you live in, friend. If a woman/family must provide everything for the child (including maternity leave, somehow), I can only conclude that you support the choice of a woman to have an abortion if she is not wealthy enough to provide everything. - Philly H. - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:18 pm: - Grandson of Man - I agree. Both Cosgrove and Skillicorn are dishonest and pandering. Zealots on the left and right are codependent. @DIstant watcher’s ABATE/helmet law comparison is spot on. - Amalia - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:18 pm: there’s a certain very large church which states that birth control pills and infertility treatments such as IVF are not right. There are others who agree. they work to reduce these choices for women or make these choices unavailable to women without means. it’s about a whole range of choices that women must have in order to have agency. choice is not just about abortion, not on the pro choice side or the anti choice side. that is why it is important to shine a light on the things that the anti side does. - Central bloc - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:19 pm: No terry, if that is really you, no one is trying to outlaw birth control. Public funding of birth control perhaps, but not birth control per se. - Arock - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:19 pm: There are many organization outside of religious ones that are Pro-Life and according to the Democrat’s Pro-Life group they say that over 1/3 of Democrats are Pro-Life. Planned Parenthood when founded indicated that abortion was wrong because it ends a life, science tells us that a unique human life begins at conception. It may not be viable outside the mother’s uterus but it does not change the fact that it is its own unique human Life with its own unique DNA. It is not a ‘blob of tissue’ when most abortions are done as this fast growing and ever changing life is most definitely a human life. - Jibba - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:27 pm: Arock…polls consistently show that the majority of the American public is not comfortable with abortion, but they are not willing to outlaw it. This is an eminently sensible position. We might believe one thing for ourselves, but are not willing to make that choice for others. That kind of thinking permeates the discourse on many issues in the public eye. - TheInvisibleMan - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:42 pm: Arock Does that mean you think the eventual existence of cloned humans will mean that they aren’t actually human? They are not unique life, which seems to be a precondition for you. Does that mean they would have no rights? That you could physically harm them as full grown adults with no consequences to yourself? - Not a Superstar - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:47 pm: Illinois GOP: proceed with this nonsense at your peril. Signed, the 18 Republicans (out of 80 members total) in the California state assembly. - Cubs in '16 - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:50 pm: ===eventual existence of cloned humans=== LOL Might wanna put down the tin foil hat there. - TheInvisibleMan - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 4:56 pm: @Cubs in 16 Not following along with current news in the field? Primates were first cloned last year. Many of them. - Huh? - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 5:02 pm: “I will believe they are serious about the sanctity of all life, no exceptions” Might want to add a prohibition on the disposal of fertilized eggs that are frozen at IVF clinics. Not one word about that topic. If life begins at conception, the frozen embryos are “human beings” that are disposed of or used for medical testing when the family no longer needs them. - Anyone Remember - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 5:04 pm: Downstate Illinois, Central bloc - Review the court filings of the Catholic diocese in Griswold. Condensed to 1 sentence, their position was if something violated Natural Law (they said all birth control violated Natural Law) AND Natural Law coincided with Catholic teachings, they had the right to push for laws that would require non-Catholics to abide by Natural Law / Catholic teaching, no matter what. Rick Santorum is still working to implement that position. - southern Illinois resident - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 5:15 pm: File this under political nuisances, amateur hour, and pandering to their minority base. This is what the GOP does best. Fortunately there is the matter of political realities. - Cosgrove - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 5:29 pm: Anyone Remember: Thank you very much for that great history lesson. I’ll file it under “you learn something new everyday.” Also related is that not a single anti-abortion organization in the country supports access to birth control, despite the fact that its availability reduces the rate of abortion by 40% as was the recent case in Colorado. The reason why wingers don’t support access to birth control is that they label the pill and IUD as “abortifacients,” and the destruction of a human life. Thus their drive to make nearly all forms of birth control illegal, opposing stem cell research and the growing anti-vaccination movement. - Cubs in '16 - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 5:56 pm: -InvisibleMan- I’m aware of the science. But I don’t believe medical ethics will allow for it to be applied in the way you’re suggesting. Maybe I’m naive but that would jump an ethical shark that I don’t like to think about. - Not a Billionaire - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 7:31 pm: Gribbon was right. - Da Big Bad Wolf - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 7:38 pm: Birth control makes abortion less common. Take away birth control and abortion increases. The countries that have few birth control options and ban abortion have high abortion rates. Countries that don’t ban abortion but have birth control have low abortion rates. Abortion rates are the lowest in countries with universal health care. https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/21/health/abortion-restriction-laws/index.html - TheInvisibleMan - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 7:42 pm: @Cubs Lets not get bogged down with details of the how. This is a thought experiment to see if you believe the things you believe. You have used the umbrella of science to rationalize your position. As science advances, at some point in our future, near or distant, there will be cloned human beings. Are those clones not human being by your definition, because they do not contain unique DNA? Would you have them with rights equal to a human with unique DNA? If not, why. If yes, why? Science shows you that life doesn’t start. It is a continuation of previous life. There is no demarcation line such as you are trying to impose for the start of life. - Da Big Bad Wolf - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 7:42 pm: ==eventual existence of cloned humans LOL Might wanna put down the tin foil hat there.== Identical twins are naturally occurring clones of each other. No tin foil hat necessary. - Anyone Remember - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 7:45 pm: Cosgrove - Thank you. As all 4 of my grandparent’s family came to these shores (3, this was the second place emigrated) to get away from people like this, I pay close attention to such matters. - Cubs in '16 - Wednesday, Jul 10, 19 @ 9:19 pm: -InvisibleMan- It wasn’t my position. You’re confusing me with Arock. - Demoralized - Thursday, Jul 11, 19 @ 7:40 am: ==Those things are the responsibility of the parents, end of story. == No, that’s not the end of the story. This is all too frequently the attitude of those against abortion. And it’s the absolute wrong attitude. - Demoralized - Thursday, Jul 11, 19 @ 7:42 am: ==Public funding of birth control perhaps, but not birth control per se.== Are you against public funding of birth control? If you are that’s another strike against you and is more indication of an extreme viewpoint - Da Big Bad Wolf - Thursday, Jul 11, 19 @ 10:36 am: ===Those things are the responsibility of the parents, end of story. == If you want to make abortion go away then its the responsibility of the society that wants abortion to go away. If you want to live in a society with high abortion rates than it’s the end of the story. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.