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*** UPDATED x2 - 9 Indy CEOs demand changes - Wilco bites Indiana *** Indiana bites back

Monday, Mar 30, 2015

* A spokesperson for Indiana’s governor responds to Mayor Emanuel’s harsh criticism of that state’s new “religious freedom” law

“We value every business here in Indiana. Our businesses want to be here because Indiana is a great place to do business—far better than Illinois by just about any measure.

“The current issue is a matter of intense and ongoing debate,” she adds, referring to talk of “clarifying” the law. “The governor’s office is leading all efforts with regard to that issue.”

Indeed, Indiana is a particularly good place to do business right now if you hate gays.

/snark

*** UPDATE 1 *** Apparently, Indiana is not such a great place for the concert promotion business

The indie folk rock heroes of Wilco have canceled a May 7 concert in Indianapolis following the controversial passage of the Indiana Religious Freedom Restoration Act. […]

In a Monday statement on the band’s Facebook page, Wilco wrote:

    “We are canceling our May 7 show at the Murat in Indianapolis. The “Indiana Religious Freedom Restoration Act” feels like thinly disguised legal discrimination to us. Hope to get back to the Hoosier State someday soon, when this odious measure is repealed. Refunds available at point of purchase.”

“I guess all this history, it’s just a mystery to me.”

…Adding… Indy Star

A labor union that represents public employees will pull its October conference for women out of Indianapolis, making it the first convention to pull out of the city because of objections to a new religious freedom law.

The AFSCME, which represents nurses, corrections officers, child care workers and sanitation workers, among others, said its decision is a direct result of Gov. Mike Pence signing into law a bill that its press release says “legalizes discrimination.”

“This un-American law allowing businesses to refuse service to gay and lesbian customers sets Indiana and our nation back decades in the struggle for civil rights,” AFSCME President Lee Saunders said in a statement.

The conference was due to bring 700 to 900 people to Indianapolis from all over the country for a three-day conference based at the JW Marriott Indianapolis. (Union officials clarified their statement earlier Monday that the conference was to be based at another hotel). Union officials have not decided upon a new city for the conference.

*** UPDATE 2 *** Indy Star

Top executives at nine major Indiana companies today called on Gov. Mike Pence and legislative leaders to reform the newly passed Religious Freedom Restoration Act so it can’t be used to “justify discrimination based upon sexual orientation or gender identity.” […]

“Regardless of the original intention of the Religious Freedom Restoration Act, we are deeply concerned about the impact it is having on our employees and on the reputation of our state,” the letter says. […]

Jon Mills, spokesman for Cummins Inc. CEO John Linebarger, said changing the RFRA legislation likely will involve introducing a new amendment or stripping part of an existing bill to insert language that would modify the RFRA. […]

Other executives signing the letter were Bill Oesterle, CEO of Angie’s List; Joseph Swedish, CEO of Anthem; Jeff Smulyan, CEO of Emmis Communications; Dan Evans, CEO of Indiana University Health; Jack Phillips, CEO of Roche Diagnostics; John Lechleiter, CEO of Eli Lilly and Co.; and Tim Hassinger, CEO of Dow AgroSciences.

- Posted by Rich Miller        

95 Comments
  1. - Ducky LaMoore - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:27 pm:

    Good, his office is handling efforts. If the governor himself was, then a simple yes or no would turn into a national catastrophe….


  2. - 47th Ward - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:30 pm:

    ===Indiana is a great place to do business===

    “Why just today Hobby Lobby and Chick-Fil-A announced they’ll be expanding here and one of our more famous white citizens fraternal organizations announced it would be adopting another long stretch of Interstate 74.”


  3. - Crispy - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:34 pm:

    Spin away, Indiana. Meanwhile, San Francisco, Seattle and now Connecticut have announced official Indiana business boycotts, and AFSCME just pulled its 2015 women’s conference from Indianapolis. Oh, well!


  4. - Roamin' Numeral - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:36 pm:

    Let’s see, I wonder if there are any large college athletic events going on this weekend in Indiana? Perhaps groups opposed to the law will use that as an opportunity to protest.


  5. - Crispy - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:36 pm:

    Plus Salesforce.com, Angie’s List, and the NFL and Big Ten are “studying” the issue. Probably just the top of a growing list. …


  6. - Gooner - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:37 pm:

    Clarifying? What’s to clarify? The law is not ambiguous.

    It is odd that she would be dishonest about a law passed to allow people to “practice their religion.”

    I wonder if dishonesty is consistent with their religion, or whether they are only concerned with who people sleep with. Are they going to refuse to allow her in to their businesses based on that one?


  7. - Amalia - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:37 pm:

    yeah, I get from some in the LGBT community that they don’t want their state to be boycotted cause it hurts their businesses. but the only way to go is to do what Arizona got on the MLK issue…raise hell. and that is what should happen during the NCCA final four. protests. lots of them.


  8. - anonin' - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:39 pm:

    Gosh darn…are we gonna be East MO. or West IN.
    Can’t stand the confusion. Pretty funny Pence signs thewhackjobs bill and in less than a week need to talk about “clarifyin” someone tell BVR et al that’s what IL calls a “trailer” bill.
    Pence and IN whacks would think that is a housin’ measure


  9. - Stones - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:39 pm:

    Indiana has Illinois beat in terms of fireworks…that’s about it.


  10. - D.P.Gumby - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:40 pm:

    Pence’s national ambitions died on This Week w/ his feeble avoidance of George’s questions…


  11. - Sir Reel - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:41 pm:

    The only “clarifying” that would fix it is called “repeal.”


  12. - Ghost - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:46 pm:

    Indiana, where the average houshold income is in decline, the middle class is shrinking…. And the dont let “those” people into their buisnesses.

    I hear he ammendment will require seperate but equal restrooms, water fountains, restraints etc.

    In fact they are looking at making Gary indiana a right to be gay zone and just interring all of the gay’s in their own reservation


  13. - MrJM - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:49 pm:

    We value every business here in Indiana.

    “We just don’t value every citizen.”

    – MrJM


  14. - Em - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 3:57 pm:

    Yes! Just another reason to love Wilco. Hope other bands take their lead.


  15. - Jocko - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:00 pm:

    Katelyn Prentice can try to spin this all they want but Pence signed it, so he (and she) have to own it.


  16. - Christopher - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:02 pm:

    Thank you, Wilco, for standing up to Indiana. I hope that others follow your lead!


  17. - Anonymous - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:03 pm:

    Heh.

    http://youtu.be/BTsuhJCW5RY


  18. - Rivercabin - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:06 pm:

    A great gay business opportunity in Indiana would be making wedding cakes.


  19. - Wordslinger - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:07 pm:

    —…Indiana is a great place to do business — far better than Illinois by just about any measure.–

    Okay.

    What measures would you like to use, shorty?

    GDP? Number of employed? Number of businesses? Business startups? Per capita income? And on and on and on….

    Same geographic location. About the same size. Same lake access. You go-getters even beat us into the union by a couple years.

    You can spin yourself silly, but $721 billion annual GDP remains a wee bit more than $317 billion.

    That’s free people and capital in a mobile society making decisions on their own as to where they want to live and make a living.

    With all of our similarities, why are you so small? Why are the biggest chunks of your economy tied to their proximity to Chicago, Detroit and Toledo?

    While the people of Illinois were at the vanguard advancing the rights of labor, you guys put the Klan in charge of state government to smack down the Jews, Catholics and blacks.

    Illinois is one of the few states in the union where their elected representatives legalized same-sex marriage. What did you guys do last week?

    If the national spotlight you enjoyed last weekend doesnt give you a clue, you’ll never get it. If you aspire to be Mississippi, salud, leave your Yankee at the door on the way out.

    These guys. It’s like the little kid in the neighborhood taking wild swings at you, while you just put the palm to his forehead.


  20. - 47th Ward - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:09 pm:

    ===A great gay business opportunity in Indiana would be making wedding cakes.===

    Or maybe Indiana-shaped urinal cakes. You could sell those coast-to-coast.


  21. - Bogey Golfer - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:10 pm:

    ==yeah, I get from some in the LGBT community that they don’t want their state to be boycotted cause it hurts their businesses. but the only way to go is to do what Arizona got on the MLK issue…raise hell. and that is what should happen during the NCCA final four. protests. lots of them.==

    The 2016 NCAA Women’s Final Four for Division I, II, and III is scheduled for Indy. I would expect the NCAA (headquartered in Indy) could have an announcement next week.


  22. - NewWestSuburbanGop'er - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:16 pm:

    I hope more conventions leave Indianapolis.


  23. - John A Logan - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:17 pm:

    Is there a great victimization of people in the LGBT community going on in Indiana? Of course not. Is this comparable to the civil rights movement? Obviously not. We are talking about bakery’s not wanted to make wedding cakes for gay couples. This is not a National Tragedy…it’s the people reaffirming their beliefs. I say good for them, and shame on everyone who wants to throw stones at them for it.


  24. - Rich Miller - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:19 pm:

    ===We are talking about bakery’s not wanted to make wedding cakes for gay couples===

    You may want to think again. It’s way beyond that. Way.


  25. - JS Mill - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:22 pm:

    Word beat me to it! Well done! Add in higher taxes to boot!

    BTW- You can take the same numbers and apply them to all of our neighboring states, the others just are not as unfriendly to all of our citizens!


  26. - vise77 - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:26 pm:

    “Is this comparable to the civil rights movement? Obviously not. ”

    Do I need a passport to visit your world of fantasy and willful obtuseness?


  27. - Gooner - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:26 pm:

    Logan, religious objections were used to justify whites-only behavior.

    Is the black experience in America the equivalent of the gay experience? Of course not. Only one of those two were brought here in chains.

    However, “Group A had it worse than Group B” does not justify discrimination against Group B.

    People need to decide if discrimination is wrong. In Indiana, they’ve decided that discrimination is OK.

    Now businesses will need to decide if they want to continue to do business that would legally allow discrimination.


  28. - Wensicia - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:26 pm:

    Governor Bigot is refusing to back away from this law.

    It’s gonna be the Final Four in more ways than one.


  29. - Lot 49 - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:26 pm:

    “Indiana is a particularly good place to do business right now if you hate gays.”

    Lefties may win the culture through execrable ad hominem attacks and bald-faced lies like this, but they lose their integrity along the deceptive, manipulative way.


  30. - Rich Miller - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:28 pm:

    Lot 49, it was clearly labeled as snark.

    Take a breath.

    These Hoosiers have been whacking my state for years. Payback is a… well, you know…


  31. - Christopher - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:28 pm:

    Thank you also to AFSCME, which represents nurses, corrections officers, child care workers and sanitation workers, among others, for pulling its convention out of Indianapolis.

    To John A Logan: Mr. Logan, I think it is a national tragedy that all citizens are not equal. Shame on those who have hatred or judgement in their hearts for others!


  32. - The Dude Abides - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:29 pm:

    Thank you to WILCO and AFSCME for standing up for the rights of ALL citizens.


  33. - lake county democrat - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:30 pm:

    John Logan: What “beliefs”? These same people believe that being an Orthodox Jew sends you to the same eternal fire as being gay, and the former is a far greater “lifestyle choice” (it impacts everything, not just sexuality) but it’s protected. When they start refusing service to Sabbath breakers like NFL players and the people working the stadiums, security, etc., get back to us.


  34. - Demoralized - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:30 pm:

    ==it’s the people reaffirming their beliefs. I say good for them, and shame on everyone who wants to throw stones at them for it.==

    Good for them? You aren’t being serious are you? Why in the world would we pat somebody on the back for being discriminatory?

    When somebody acts like a bigot they deserve to have stones thrown at them.


  35. - Gooner - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:32 pm:

    By the way, let’s all be honest here — this has nothing to do with religion.

    None of the businesses who decide to discriminate are going to ask a male/female couple to see their marriage license (in the case of a restaurant or hotel) or whether it was the first marriage (for those poor oppressed bakers).

    Those religious values do not matter. They care about gay people. It has zero to do with religion and is all about simply not liking a group of people.

    As long as we are talking about strongly held religious views, we should avoid dishonesty on the issue, especially since dishonesty is contrary to most religions.


  36. - Hedley Lamarr - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:33 pm:

    =Indiana is a great state to do business=

    Which is why a company recently left northern Indiana for Mexico.


  37. - AC - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:35 pm:

    Indiana has a problem, their reputation is already irreparably damaged, and they are now viewed as a hotbed of prejudice and discrimination. Boycotting Indiana is now way too popular for their own good. Even if they change course, there are a lot of people who won’t remember that, because being reasonable just won’t make the headlines the same way.


  38. - And I Approved This Message - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:37 pm:

    Wow. I thought whoever orchestrated the Schock Attack was good at what they did. This is moving at warp speed.


  39. - Wensicia - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:39 pm:

    ==this has nothing to do with religion==

    Exactly.


  40. - Chicago Guy - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:40 pm:

    AC - You are right. I cancelled a vacation trip to Indiana but figured I would go when they change the law. At this point, I’m not going until at a minimum they change the law and Gov. Pence is out of office.

    And big cheers for Wilco.


  41. - William - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:43 pm:

    The national debate on this measure would be better if those opposed read the bill. Unfortunately, the facts be damned when a good faux crisis can be ginned up. When will we stop with the religiousphobia?


  42. - Wordslinger - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:43 pm:

    John Logan, what are you talking about, exactly? I’m at a loss.

    What would be your hopes for the successful application of this law?


  43. - Christopher - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:47 pm:

    How can, in this day and age, Pence say that protecting LGBT citizens from discrimination is not “on his agenda”? Doesn’t he represent all of the people of Indiana, or just the ones who think the way that he does?


  44. - Ouch! - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:48 pm:

    Where will buy firecrackers and cherry bombs now?


  45. - Chris - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:54 pm:

    “===We are talking about bakery’s not wanted to make wedding cakes for gay couples===”

    Think of it as Allen Iverson talking about practice:

    “I mean, listen, we’re talking about cakes, not a marriage, not a marriage, not a marriage, we talking about cakes. Not a marriage. Not, not … Not the marriage that I go out there and die for and play every [day] like it’s my last. Not the marriage, but we’re talking about cakes, man. I mean, how silly is that? … And we talking about cakes.”


  46. - PoolGuy - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:55 pm:

    John Logan, what if it was a bakery not wanting to make a wedding cake for an interracial couple, or an unwed mother? that bother you any? and “throwing stones” really?


  47. - vise77 - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:56 pm:

    “When will we stop with the religiousphobia? “‘

    Do your palms hurt from the nail holes?


  48. - union hotel? - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:56 pm:

    afscme,why would they have a convention in indiana anyway?

    wilco, right on!


  49. - Arthur Andersen - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:56 pm:

    Move the 500!


  50. - PoolGuy - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 4:57 pm:

    I think Indiana has just “reaffirmed” who they thinks it’s okay to throw stones at.


  51. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:01 pm:

    If you’re explaining, you’re losing, and even worse, you know you’re wrong but didn’t know it

    Pathetic.


  52. - Jocko - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:07 pm:

    “[I]ndividuals can cite their personal religious beliefs to refuse service to a customer..”

    In this instance, a customer is defined as one of “those people” nudge, nudge.


  53. - Sam Weinberg - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:10 pm:

    Why would anyone think this is about religious-based “dislike” of homosexuals? I dunno … let’s ask Indiana’s “largest pro-family, pro-church, pro-private and home school, and pro-tax reform organization”:

    http://www.advanceamerica.com/blog/?p=1849


  54. - VanillaMan - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:11 pm:

    Anyone willing to force Muslims to do what it seems so easy to mock other religions over?


  55. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:18 pm:

    To the Second Update;

    Its as though the government is not listening to the leaders of industry and society, or the far Right politics make hearing impossible.


  56. - Last Bull Moose - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:20 pm:

    9 CEO’S acted quickly. That is the part of Indiana I like.

    In my youth, bigotry was contained by an even stronger sense of “mind your own business “. Unless you were directly harmed, what your neighbors did was strictly their business.


  57. - Chicago Guy - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:22 pm:

    A common idea in economic development is that cities need to attract the educated young creative people in order to prosper. One common way to measure a city’s attractiveness to the “creative class” is if the City is considered gay-friendly. I don’t think the theory is perfect, but economic development is like politics - a game of addition not subtraction.


  58. - Anonymous - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:27 pm:

    Hey Bruce, you see how easy it is for real businessmen to respond to bigotry?

    I guess you have to run a business that does more than buy and dismantle other businesses to develop a spine. Coward.


  59. - MrJM - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:36 pm:

    “Is there a great victimization of people in the LGBT community going on in Indiana? Of course not.”

    Plenty of callous retrogrades said the same thing about blacks not getting to sit a the lunch counter.

    “Is this comparable to the civil rights movement? Obviously not.”

    See above.

    – MrJM


  60. - MrJM - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:37 pm:

    * “sit at the lunch counter”


  61. - Paddyrollingstone - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:39 pm:

    When asked the Dalai Lama said
    “My religion is very simple. My religion is kindness.”


  62. - Annon3 - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:41 pm:

    I now understand why all the Hoosiers are fleeing to work for the Rauner Administration.


  63. - yinn - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:51 pm:

    Last summer we buried my bro-in-law near Michigan City. We’d lost his SO a couple years before that.

    During the memorial service we talked hopefully about how gay marriage seemed just around the corner for Hoosiers and most of all about this couple who were so courageously, openly gay and obviously married in every other way for more than 25 years.

    (And oh yeah, part of that 25+ years they owned a bakery and made party cakes both naughty and nice.)

    I think they’d be awestruck, hopeful and appreciative of this backlash against discrimination. I am — I’m sad but only because I miss them.


  64. - Chicago Cynic - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 5:54 pm:

    Mike Pence was pathetic yesterday in trying to defend this law, as have commenters here. You argue this has nothing to do with gays, and yet the people the governor surrounded him with at the bill signing quite clearly were there because it was anti-Gay. Sorry, you just can’t have it both ways.

    Don’t believe me, check out this pic from the fine folks at GLAAD:

    http://www.glaad.org/blog/ashton-kutcher-miley-cyrus-ellen-degeneres-and-more-celebs-speak-out-against-indianas-anti-lgbt


  65. - Gooner - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 6:06 pm:

    Vanilla Man, the answer to that is”everybody.” Great paranoia there though.


  66. - Anonymous - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 6:17 pm:

    - Anyone willing to force Muslims to do what it seems so easy to mock other religions over? -

    We do here in Illinois, genius.


  67. - Macbeth - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 6:17 pm:

    As soon as a pol — any pol, including Rauner — includes, “…has nothing to do with …” then you know it has *everything* to do with.

    Pence in Indiana and, yes, Rauner here (regarding labor). Ditto for: “Not on my agenda.”

    That’s the sentence that’s fast becoming the GOPs biggest lie in the 21st century.


  68. - Grandson of Man - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 6:20 pm:

    It’s comical how Pence and other supporters of the law are trying to spin this, like the law is inclusive. It looks like it’s really backfiring, because there is talk of amending this law to protect patrons of businesses.

    The reported rationale for the law is to protect “religious minorities” from discriminatory government laws. In other words, it’s to allow Hoosier businesses to discriminate against gay couples by circumventing SCOTUS rulings and federal laws.

    Where are the vocal supporters of the law? I look forward to hearing from the Duck Dynasty guy and others like him.


  69. - Anonymous - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 6:22 pm:

    In 1993, Bill Clinton,signed into law a bill similar to this one. The Supreme Court in the Hobby Lobby case upheld the principals involved in the law. This law does not apply to disputes between individuals. It only applies when the government has decreed that somebody do something that is against their religious beliefs.


  70. - Wordslinger - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 6:28 pm:

    Vman, if you’re worried about “Muslims” using state law to discriminate against some of God’s own children here in these secular United States in the year 2015, then I’m with you, cousin.

    But this Lutheran and this American will not accept the perversion of any “faith” to justify discrimination in the public square.

    “We’ the People,” baby. “E Pluribus Unum.”

    And, my favorite, get your grill out of my business.


  71. - railrat - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 6:53 pm:

    where’s the great Eagle Forum and the IFI ??? crickets..!!>>!!!…..!!!


  72. - walker - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 6:56 pm:

    These CEOs are not late to this issue and just reacting to the national. Heard that some of them tried to kill the bill in committee.

    Used to be the business big in IN pretty much were the final word on legislation, especially for Republicans. They leveraged and allied wth the social and religious conservatives as needed.

    It appears the GOP party control has shifted a bit in IN.


  73. - ArchPundit - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 6:59 pm:

    Oh, c’mon Jake couldn’t even stop by to comment on Wilco? And I thought I was lame.


  74. - railrat - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 7:02 pm:

    looking to open a shop for jodhpurs, riding crops, mustache’s short,drab brown apparel and knee boots…..any info for Indiana location accepted !!!


  75. - Wordslinger - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 7:03 pm:

    Anon 6:22, guess what? It’s not 1993 anymore.That was 22 years ago.

    I imagine you might have to take off your shoes to count to 20,.

    I know how youd get to 21, that’s bad enough.

    But spare me how you get to 22.


  76. - GraduatedCollegeStudent - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 7:15 pm:

    ===In 1993, Bill Clinton,signed into law a bill similar to this one. The Supreme Court in the Hobby Lobby case upheld the principals involved in the law. This law does not apply to disputes between individuals. It only applies when the government has decreed that somebody do something that is against their religious beliefs. ====

    Except for the part where 1) Indiana’s RFRA “protections” involve ALL for-profit corporations (and not just family-held ones like Hobby Lobby), as well as shielding those it protects from private lawsuits (unlike the Federal statute and most state ones, including Illinois), and 2) LGBTs are not considered a protected class by Indiana law and therefore are not shielded from discrimination.


  77. - railrat - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 7:25 pm:

    Hemingway, Gertrude Stein, Fitzgerald, I would assume are flipping over in their cherished graves over this when Illinois Indiana and the USA have so many more important “issues” to confront….how sad


  78. - Ben Horne - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 7:26 pm:

    ==The 2016 NCAA Women’s Final Four for Division I, II, and III is scheduled for Indy.==

    And people are opposed to RFRA?


  79. - Ben Horne - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 7:27 pm:

    If it’s not too much trouble, could one of the AFSCMEbots explain how this new law “legalizes discrimination” in Indiana?


  80. - Anonymous - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 7:31 pm:

    - AFSCMEbots -

    You’re going to poke fun at public employees when you apparently can’t read?

    Might rethink that.


  81. - Ben Horne - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 7:42 pm:

    ==You’re going to poke fun at public employees when you apparently can’t read?==

    From the article:

    The AFSCME, which represents state, county and other municipal employees from around the county, said its decision was a direct result of Gov. Mike Pence signing a bill into law that the union says “legalizes discrimination.”


  82. - Ben Horne - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 8:05 pm:

    ==If you’re explaining, you’re losing, and even worse, you know you’re wrong but didn’t know it==

    Basically, progs can start dumpster fire of willful ignorance and lies, but don’t bother trying to respond.

    More succinctly, LALALALALALALALALALA

    Yikes.


  83. - 47th Ward - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 8:06 pm:

    Railrat, what issues are more important than civil rights for every American?


  84. - Just the fax - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 8:08 pm:

    Re AFSCME’s rationale, the union’s full statement is here. Thanks, Google. http://www.afscme.org/blog/afscme-pulls-womens-conference-out-of-indiana


  85. - PatrickinCary - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 8:21 pm:

    Yup, Ben Horne, ‘Legalizes Discrimination’. The baker who didn’t want to make the same sex wedding cake didn’t claim he wasn’t discriminating; he claimed that he had a religious reason to discriminate. This law creates that defense to a claim of unlawful discrimination, by making some discrimination lawful depending on the ‘why’. So in lay language, this statute is absolutely legalizing discrimination.


  86. - jeffinginChicago - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 8:27 pm:

    Apple will not accept applications on their platform they deem to be offensive. Who sets that standard? How can they keep that up with Cook’s letter against the RFRA? Don’t they have to serve everyone just like Mr Cook’s letter demands of Indiana?


  87. - Curious - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 8:35 pm:

    Let businesses do what they want. Citizens can let them know how they feel with where they spend, or don’t spend, their money.


  88. - Down Here - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 8:44 pm:

    Uh, kudos to AFSCME for pulling the plug on their convention in Indiana, but am I missing something or why would AFSME–or any union for that matter–have a convention in Indiana in the first place? Isn’t Indiana “right to work” and don’t all unions hate Indiana because of it and Public Enemy #2 former Governor Mitch Daniels? (Rauner is now P.E.#1, I think.) Why would they have a convention there which helps that state’s economy?


  89. - Chicago Guy - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 9:48 pm:

    Curious - So it is okay to discriminate? Letting markets decide was tried until the 1960s and didn’t work well for a lot of people.


  90. - Chicago Guy - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 10:06 pm:

    Here is a scenario that I don’t know how would play out under the new law:

    I have reservations at a national chain hotel. I show up with my boyfriend. The room has a single king size bed. Its the night shift and the only clerk working refuses to rent the room based on their religious beliefs. One impact is I have to tract down another hotel room. But the other issue is can the hotel chain fire the employee for refusing to rent the room? Wouldn’t that be violating the employee’s religious freedom?


  91. - Chicago Guy - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 10:06 pm:

    The way I’m understanding some on the right is they would say the clerk couldn’t deny me the room because it would be anti-gay discrimination but if I told her it was my honeymoon it would be okay because then I was making her part of my gay marriage. A similar case is a bakery couldn’t refuse to sell be a cake, but they could refuse to sell me a wedding cake. I presume the ability to sell me an anniversary cake would depend on what denomination they belong to.


  92. - Gerson - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 10:21 pm:

    With Lilly coming out against this law, it will be repealed in 3 … 2 … 1 …


  93. - Ben Horne - Monday, Mar 30, 15 @ 11:03 pm:

    Several of my comments deleted - ostensibly for excessive rabidity. I won’t even bother to defend it - the fact that I get censored in light of the latent (and often not) vitriol, the untruths, the use of “snark” as an out to cover for what probably are true feelings…whatever.

    I could point people to several sharp legal minds who have commented publicly on this issue - most who support gay marriage, at least one who is gay himself. But hey, when you’re an internet lawyer operating on a “bigot” pull-string, who needs that real world expertise?

    For those who don’t want to get bullied on this, do some basic research. It’s nice when the debate doesn’t even have to get into the normative realm, i.e. the other side is just blatantly wrong on the facts but manage to “win” by sheer number of folks saying the same wrong thing the most maniacally.

    Carry on.


  94. - Rich Miller - Tuesday, Mar 31, 15 @ 12:01 am:

    ===For those who don’t want to get bullied on this, do some basic research===

    Another ignorant victim heard from.


  95. - Upon Further Review - Tuesday, Mar 31, 15 @ 4:31 pm:

    Stop the presses! Arkansas has passed a similar law to that enacted in Indiana.

    It is time for all of the Illinois politicians to express their righteous indignation.


Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.


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