118 Comments - Apocalypse Now - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:34 am: Great victory for the people of Illinois. - Demoralized - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:38 am: == If it had passed, state employee pay raises would have been on cruise control== Not sure how they come to that conclusion but facts haven’t been overabundant during this crazy session. ==At a time when private sector employees == More “us vs. them” rhetoric I guess we’ll wait and see what happens. Hopefully the Governor meant what he said when he constantly speaks of negotiating in good faith. I have a fear that he’ll simply submit the state’s final offer and tell the union to take it or leave it. Some of you think this is a “great victory.” I hope you are right. I hope this is a victory that leads to rational behavior on all sides. - Demoralized - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:42 am: And I’m also disappointed in those that voted present. They didn’t have the cajones to pick a side. And I’m very disappointed that Raymond Poe was one of those individuals. We have now reached a new low in my opinion of legislators lacking any sort of statesmanship whatsoever. When they completely fail in their jobs (and I believe a present vote, when not done for conflict of interest reasons) is a failure to do their jobs, then as far as I’m concerned they do not belong in the General Assembly. Shame on those voting present. - Wensicia - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:46 am: ==I can’t simply reduce the budget and balance it without legislative changes.== You could have, but you didn’t have the guts to make needed cuts with your name attached to them. - Anon2U - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:49 am: So will the Illinois Chamber no longer endorse Sente? - Anonymous - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:50 am: When they refuse to do the job they are elected for, by voting present, rather than representing the wishes of those who elected them, why do they receive pay? So many seem to be all over state employees, as if they are the ones who own nine houses………why do legislators get away with this? - Wondering - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:56 am: Good news. Move on. - Jeep - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:57 am: Rauner and the Chamber of Commerce make it seem as if it is the state worker salaries careening the state into the red, but maybe we should look at legislative salaries too. If they’re just voting present - what’s the point of them? And this dereliction of duty from one of the highest paid legislatures in the country. Maybe they can save our poor in the red state by cutting pay and benefits of any legislature that votes “present” one to many times. - A Jack - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:57 am: Well Governor, those 68 who voted yes are telling you your turn-around agenda is dead. And so much for your argument of Madigan and the legislatures he controls. Now it’s Rauner and the legislatures he controls who are shutting down government services. - illinoised - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:58 am: The result of that vote was not a victory or loss for either side of the political spectrum, had no impact on their ability to negotiate a budget. So tired of blah blah blah from him and GA. - Triple fat - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:03 am: Yes, it would’ve been nice if the General Assembly had fought was is basically our fight as AFSCME employees. It would have been great. Now the responsibility of obtaining a fair contract rests with us - the workers. We have to stand united and stand strong. We need to stand up to the bully and make him wish that he had never vetoed SB1229. It ain’t over just because a couple of lame duck Representatives failed to vote their districts. We’ve got this thing from here! Courage Kenneth. - Last Bull Moose - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:05 am: If either party has been slow walking the AFSCME negotiations,it is time to pick up the pace. This is a conflict on multiple fronts, courts, negotiating tables, GA. Where do people think the next hotspot to be? - burbanite - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:06 am: The rope has been handed to the Gov. now we wait and see what he does with it. - chad - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:10 am: A PATCO moment is coming. And, quit the picking-on Poe. He has done just about everything the unions ever asked him to. That he wouldn’t fall on his sword over this hair-brained attempted theft of executive power is a credit to his, not the result of intimidation. - Triple fat - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:10 am: General assembly investigations into the Governor’s strong arm tactics. That would be my guess. We can get to that budget thingy, whenever… I was operating under the assumption that the Speaker still had a plan. Everyone - I was wrong! - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:14 am: Rauner won a huge victory. While the cost is Leader Durkin looking like “Speaker Madigan and the legislators he controls… ” when holding his powder, Durkin could’ve just waited for Dunkin’s no-show to comment. A disappointing unforced error, and bad form publicly. Lost a great deal of respect for the GOP Cowards, because in reality, the Labor Movement here in Illinois can’t do much to you. The members in Labor have proven voting against their best interests, that’s their calling card. The most puzzling for me? That’s easy; Speaker Madigan, the “71″ he thought he had, Ken Dunkin, Jack Franks, the “no” by Rep. Drury, and… The Democrats and the way they handled their business on this? They made themselves look silly. Rauner’s victory is well-earned. If this was a Democratic bluff, they called at the right time. If this was Ken Dunkin just being Ken Dunkin, that might be even sadder. Rauner won in November, Rauner won yesterday. Rauner has Labor to thank for both. - Anon - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:15 am: Madison wanted it to fail. He knew it was probably not good policy, but he wanted his members on record as supporting labor. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:16 am: - chad -, No it’s not coming. Ugh. - Triple fat - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:16 am: In case anyone was wondering… Or cared… My bromance with Speaker Madigan is officially over! - chad - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:23 am: Triple: Sadly, I agree with your comment that there does not seem to be a Speaker’s plan on this and other key issues. I’d been trying to discern one since the election, but the impact of the voter’s judgment that the State needs a significant correction has overwhelmed the GA. The Speaker seems to use smart, short-term tactical moves in an attempt to hold things off until Rauner’s voter mandate expires. I had hoped for statesmanship. - Nickname#2 - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:26 am: =We have now entered our third month without a balanced budget, which only the legislature can pass, and court orders have shown that I can’t simply reduce the budget and balance it without legislative changes.= Yes, the only the legislature can pass a balanced budget… a balanced budget that the governor proposes pursuant to the Constitution. - chad - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:27 am: OW: The comment is offered with the thought that AFSCME will continue to over-reach, meaning strike. Only then would Rauner “go for it”. I think he would have sufficient public support in that case. - Governor Bruce Pickett - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:27 am: I won. Now for my next trick, I will march more of my skeleton Crew Caucus out on a limb and saw it off behind them. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:31 am: - chad - You don’t understand what happened with PATCO and why its not possible with AFSCME. Please learn. - Nickname #2 - You sound really knowledgeable and everything except governors have vetoes to make budgets work, Rauner refused. Governors own budgets, not legislatures. Not my rule, just been that way since forever. The budget is on Gov. Rauner, as Ounce of Prevention… - Louis G. Atsaves - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:34 am: Minority Leader Durkin was masterful in shredding this bill apart through his questioning yesterday. He took a lousy bill that would have harmed the State of Illinois and turned lousy into horrifying, just by concentrating on facts. - 35/Shields - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:34 am: There’s a real danger in bragging about winning a thrown fight. If the Gov’s folks don’t harp on this one too long and see it for what it (probably) was–an olive branch–I’d be impressed. - Red Dog - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:37 am: It is a representative government. Poe did not vote the wishes of those who elected him. He should come out an explain why. Butler is understandable, because Rauner brought him to the dance. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:37 am: Um - Louis G Atsaves - Let’s be honest; Madigan didn’t have 71. That was the ball game. Leader Durkin and the Caucus he controls for Rauner and his money won, not because Durkin was Perry Mason, but because Speaker Madigan was Sen. Steans when it came down to Ken Dunkin. - Curious Georgina - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:37 am: I would like to wish Raymond Poe a speedy recovery from the spine removal surgery he apparently had recently. - Anonymous - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:41 am: Madigan wins again! Dems will now gain Poe and Butler’s seats next election. - JS Mill - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:43 am: =Labor have proven voting against their best interests, that’s their calling card.= OW- Labor is not alone in this movement and it has been happening for some time. In general, the middle class and especially the “conservative” middle class has been voting in direct opposition to their best economic interest. For reasons that are not clear, they continue to carry the mail for the true economic elites like Rauner. Perplexing. =when private sector employees are lucky to see small raises if any= A narrative that is not proven out by data…the data set I saw last week, from the state no less, showed private sector pay increasing ahead of public sector pay. It is only one data set. I am not advocating nor am I opposing equivalent increases for public and private sector. Public sector workers are entitled to reasonable compensation. I know some believe reasonable means nothing but the privilege of working for free but seriously, I would like to see something tangible from the Governor and the likes of the chamber as to what public sector workers should be making. - lake county democrat - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:46 am: Should anonymous commenters be calling anyone cowards? Im not immune to that but still… I still dont see the apocalypse here - the Dems arent going to let Rauner pass a scott walker agenda because they couldnt pass a crap bill that as far as I could see no objective analyst supported and its proponents claimed was no big deal. - Allen D - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:47 am: I believe I saw in past AFSCME material, (I could be wrong) that they were steadfast on an 11.2% pay increase….. That is not reasonable compensation that is taxpayer robbery. Help your neighbor without putting your hand in his pocket first. We get paid more than enough. - A Jack - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:48 am: Dunkin had some pretty good committee assignments. Next time he should only be on the state fair horse barn clean-up committee, along with Franks. - CB - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:49 am: Well know that this is over maybe AFSCME will actually negotiate instead of stalling until this bill either passed or failed. You know they were banking on this bill to bail them out in the negotiations. - Lincoln Lad - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:49 am: John Cullerton - your table is ready. We’ve seen once again why the Speaker can no longer lead this state successfully through the huge issues it faces. It’s time for someone to step up, broker a compromise on the budget, and try to broker a compromise with labor. The ‘my way or the highway’ approach of MJM only gets weaker from here. He’s lost, and only more mistakes are going to follow. And most telling, if you listen to him and his cohorts, Ken Dunkin is to blame. Give me a break, this is on the threshold of embarrassing. - Strangerthings - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:52 am: You sound really knowledgeable and everything except governors have vetoes to make budgets work, Rauner refused. Governors own budgets, not legislatures. Not my rule, just been that way since forever. The budget is on Gov. Rauner, as Ounce of Prevention… I don’t want to start a fight here…but isn’t who owns the budget a matter of perspective? Let’s clarify a few things here. First off having the option to use and being expected to use a line item veto are two very different things. So that being the case let’s be real here. A governor has both vetos’ for a reason it is a governors perogative to decide if it is sufficient to make a few fixes to a budget and pass it or send it back and essentially ask a legislature to take another look and reconsider the budget they passed. His ownership of the budget to be clear is no greater than the ownership of any member of the legislature who votes on it. They help create it. - anon - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:55 am: JS Mill, the public sector gets reasonable compensation. In many cases, more than reasonable compensation. Good grief, it isn’t difficult to compare job duties in the private sector and see what a really good gig most have in the public domain. - Demoralized - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:55 am: ==The ‘my way or the highway’ approach of MJM== I can think of somebody else who has that approach also. I think his name begins with Bruce and ends with Rauner. The attitudes of those two individuals are why we are in the situation we are in now. - Peoria Guy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:57 am: It was bad legislation. Congrats to those who stepped up - Demoralized - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:58 am: ==more than reasonable compensation== What is “more than reasonable?” ==it isn’t difficult to compare job duties in the private sector == Here we go with the “us vs. them” attitude again. That goofy talk is getting old. - Tony - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 8:59 am: I think the Governor believes if he can work for free, so should everyone else. Lets not forget how much income is not earned or taxed but finds it way into the bank to pay the bills. Labor just can’t get past working for their money instead of taking (or buying)it. Labor is willing to settle for the table scraps but this governor is letting the dogs eat first and watching the rest fight for today so they don’t organize on tommorrow. Keep what you have and take from the next generation of workers.They haven’t earned anything. It is not like their income and will help pay for my retirement. (snark) - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:00 am: ===…but isn’t who owns the budget a matter of perspective?=== No it really isn’t. Governors sign budgets, those budgets fund the governors agencies, the governor then chooses if they will even spend what is allocated. The financials of the budget, including Article VIII, Section 2 (a) makes it clear, the governor proposes a budget. Again not my rule, but mandated by the state’s constitution. The reason Ounce (Mrs. Rauner’s organization) made their call to arms to call her husband is because the Governor’s Office dictates the budgetary spending of the agencies the Governor controls. This isn’t only to Rauner, but all governors before him, and after him. Governors own budgets. Not really up for any discussion - Annon3 - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:01 am: I am convinced the Speaker that at the end of the day is fine with the hair cut the unions are about to get. I sincerely hope they now fix budget. - MasterPiece - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:02 am: Is it true what I heard that the governator was a guest of honor at a Dunkin fund raiser this summer? Should we be looking for a Dunkin relative or associate to receive an appointment after a reasonable time passes? - CapnCrunch - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:02 am: “The Democrats and the way they handled their business on this? They made themselves look silly.” It didn’t take much effort, they are skilled at acquiring this status (see FY 2015 budget). - From the 'Dale to HP - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:03 am: OW, I don’t see how Rauner won. He didn’t lose, that’s for sure. But how is this a win? - Honeybear - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:04 am: Now begins the “processing” in earnest. Starve it Break it Replace it Public servants effectively lost their job 9/2/15. All that remains now is how long before they actually are replaced and what they do in the interim. - Gumby - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:04 am: A new aristocrat wants to take over the realm, promising to “Shake Up Rome”. Workers of the realm are invited to come aboard. When they arrive at the Coliseum for the victory banquet, they file past indifferent senators who are sipping cool nectar. Once inside, the gates are locked. The mighty lion licks its chops. The crowd goes wild. - Louis G. Atsaves - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:05 am: @Oswego Willy, I know how difficult it is for you to acknowledge the outstanding actions of Durbin here. When legislative races get ugly next year, those who sold out to labor’s blatant power grab in negotiating contracts should be worried. I could think of a half dozen Durbin elicited answers that should make some of the “68″ nervous. Had it been “71″ it would have been worse for them. - Yeoman - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:06 am: Don’t be fooled Madigan got everything he wanted with this vote. He exposed 1/2 dozen GOP lawmakers in state employee heavy districts, he solidified he position with Labor Leaders and extended a huge branch to public employee unions which I might add have rarely been in dem camp. Not to mention bill was bad public policy. - Demoralized - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:07 am: Honeybear: You really need to settle down. You are being irrationally hysterical. - Pot calling kettle - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:07 am: ==His ownership of the budget to be clear is no greater than the ownership of any member of the legislature who votes on it.== Have you ever paid attention to how voters vote? They might say they are disgusted with the legislators, but they usually support their own rep. and senator and focus their disgust on the rest. The Governor, on the other hand, ends up owning whatever happens and being held accountable for it. It’s the only player that everyone gets to vote on. - Snucka - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:08 am: Yesterday will be remembered as the day that Bruce Rauner emasculated Michael Madigan. - Fr. Murphy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:08 am: Where are “”Wordslinger’s” sage comments? He/she is the wisest poster here, imho. Come back, ’slinger… - Quiet Sage - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:09 am: Once every several years in Speaker Madigan’s tenure, there has come a fundamental change in strategy driven by changing political conditions. His latest grand strategy, on display during the Quinn and early Rauner administrations, was to accommodate the interests of the Civic Federation and the Illinois 1%(particularly, by supporting legislation cutting public pensions) while still using his House majorities to defend what he perceived as the fundamental interests of the Democrats’ traditional constituency in organized labor. (His perception is obviously different from that of labor people). This strategy went down in flames yesterday in what was an unprecedented attack on the Speaker’s personal credibility. Madigan will adjust. He always has in his long career. We will see what unfolds in Room 300. - JS Mill - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:11 am: = Good grief, it isn’t difficult to compare job duties in the private sector and see what a really good gig most have in the public domain.= Well, Charlie Brown, lets have some numbers. I asked for facts, you have none just like the Governor and his flunkies. The answer is simply less, in their opinion. Not based on economics or job responsibilities. I know of a handful of specific examples (granted a limited number) where the opposite is true. I suspect there are more but I want the the advocates for less to spell it out and why. Say high to the rest of the Peanuts gang! - Skeptic - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:12 am: Demo: Considering Rauner’s overt desire to bust unions and privatize State functions, while he/she may be a bit hyperbolic, I don’t think Honeybear is far from wrong. That certainly is the perspective I hear in the hallways. - JS Mill - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:14 am: @ Louis- If Durkin was really outstanding why couldn’t he get his own caucus members to go on the record with a “no” instead of a “present” vote? I get why the individuals did that politically, but if it was a big deal and a fundamental issue on principal, why not stand up for what is right? - Austin Blvd - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:16 am: Where were Pritchard, Leitch, Stewart and Winger? Everyone wants to cast stones at Dunkin, but these heroes should have been at work too. Why weren’t they in Springfield? Is it OK for them to be gone because they are in the minority Republican Party? - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:17 am: ===@Oswego Willy, I know how difficult it is for you to acknowledge the outstanding actions of Durbin here.=== The Democrats coulda used Durbin… - Louis G Atsaves - It was a vote total thing, not Leader Durkin being Perry Mason. I know how important it must be for you to reconcile that real legislative actions took place making Rauner seem like he was getting taken and Leader Durkin’s eloquence was instrumental. It wasn’t. It was “71″, and Madigan didn’t have it. BTW… If all those words Leader Durkin said would make the 68 nervous, how is it that Speaker Madigan controls them so tightly? Can’t have it both ways… - Anon - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:20 am: Butler made a good point in the story this morning that a few hundred calls (AFSCME-generated no doubt) were made to his office. Yes, he probably has a lot of state employees in his district, but my guess is that he actually DID vote his district. Many of us out here in fly-over country don’t support every AFSCME position when it comes to the state budget. Overly-generous union contracts over the years are part of how we got into this mess. Apparently the Teamsters saw the writing on the wall and worked on a deal while they could. Hopefully AFSCME will do the same now. I’ll support any of these reps that stood up to the union pressure in their districts for the greater good of trying to get this state’s budget under control. - Secret Square - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:21 am: “I am convinced the Speaker that at the end of the day is fine with the hair cut the unions are about to get.” The more I think about it the more I suspect that Rauner’s main goal — perhaps the very reason he ran for governor to begin with — was to do the “dirty work” on pensions, employee benefits and various social programs that Rahm and MJM really want done (and know has to be done if the state/city are to avoid figurative “bankruptcy”), so that THEY wouldn’t have to. - Inside_baseball - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:22 am: This is another example of Rauner winning battles and the losing war. What exactly did he win? The daily PR battle? I think ASFME will never strike and now Rauner has to force a lockout or be held in perpetual negotiations until another twist comes. Knot by knot rauner is drawing his own noose. This forced another bad vote from ILGOP members. At this rate the Dems may end 2016 with more than 71 and then Rauner is definately a one term governor. - Anonymous - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:23 am: The results were already in before the show on the floor last night, but Durkin did make the bill sponsor look like a fool trying to answer simple questions about his own bill. - Strangerthings - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:25 am: Listen no offense but I am giving a different perspective on this so I will ask you to kindly not dictate or act like you have any right to force your opinion on me willy. “It’s not really up for any discussion”? I disagree. Yes but it also says ” Appropriations for a fiscal year shall not exceed funds estimated by the General Assembly to be available during a year”. I don’t care who owns this in the end. But I don’t think that a body of individuals who have a say in that budget making regardless of whether or not they have final say can be held apart from the responsibility for it. - Jeep - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:27 am: I agree with Yeoman. And for everyone crowing about the demise of AFSCME, you’re going against you’re own interest, whether public or private sector worker. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:32 am: ===I don’t care who owns this in the end.=== Um, yes you do… ===His ownership of the budget to be clear is no greater than the ownership of any member of the legislature who votes on it.=== You seem to care, then don’t care, then you care? Pick a lane. It’s not up for discussion. Candidate Rauner himself made the point Governor Quinn owned his lump sum budgets. So… Do you care who owns a budget or not or… what exactly? - A Jack - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:39 am: Really the only thing Rauner won was the right to shut down the state through lockout or strike. He has publicly stated he will not lockout, so if he does, he will get called on that and it will be a win for the unions. If he tries to force a strike, his hands are still somewhat tied by the personnel code and fair labor laws. Those laws are not going to be changed while he is in office. Now will the public turn against the union if there is a strike? I don’t know. But historically labor protests in this state and country have been well received by the majority of people and the national press as long as they remain peaceful. And if not peaceful, it depends on who instigates the violence. If Rauner calls out the National Guard on a peaceful strike, he loses. And I can’t imagine state workers being other than peaceful, they are such an easy-going bunch. - Louis G. Atsaves - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:44 am: @JSMill and @Oswego Willy, it just wasn’t a “vote thing” yesterday, although Durkin held his coalition together, love him or hate him for that, and how he did it. His caucus didn’t break. Durkin set the table for the debate over the union power grab and “unions controlling Illinois” arguments that will most certain re-erupt during next years elections. And now its going to get ugly come election time. After yesterday’s vote, it is now officially a Union Power Grab and a Union Changing the Rules of Negotiations stunt. And some of the 68 that voted for it will have to own it. Congratulations again to Minority Leader Durkin. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:54 am: === it just wasn’t a “vote thing” yesterday=== Then Leader Durkin should’ve let members vote their districts… But… ===…although Durkin held his coalition together, love him or hate him for that, and how he did it. His caucus didn’t break.=== Leader Durkin and the legislators he controls thru Rauner’s money? Thought Rauner was different? Thought only Speaker Madigan gave ultimatums? It’s as though tiu are utterly clueless to your own hypocrisy - Louis G Atsaves - ===After yesterday’s vote, it is now officially a Union Power Grab and a Union Changing the Rules of Negotiations stunt. And some of the 68 that voted for it will have to own it.=== Not exactly. By it not passing, keeping the status quo, makes its nothing more than votes on a tally board. Words only matter if the game changes. It didn’t. The words were hollow. They were. It’s a math thing. - Lost in the weeds - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:55 am: This about private sector employees seeing little if any raises …… Not born out by facts. http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2015/09/jim-smith-speaks/ - A Jack - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:55 am: Butler voted present, not yes or no. So Anon @9:20 all that means is that he was afraid to take a stand on the issue and is a fence sitter. Does that mean he will still be in office after 2016? I guess the voters in his district can decide if they want a fence sitter to represent them. - CharlieKratos - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:55 am: How is the GOP going to blame the unionized state workers for everything next year after the union has been broken? Who will be the next bogeyman? - Mason born - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:55 am: Louis I can see what you are postulating although I find the R’s hanging together against their districts to be the worst of politics. To me it’s the end of the second half and AFSCME/MJM threw a hail mary which failed. There is a lot of football left before the ‘16 elections. Let’s not forget Rauner has not built a public consesus behind his actions as likely as voting for AFSCME can be seen as a negative it’s equally likely supporting Rauner could be the kiss of death. Besides thar unified caucus is still going to vote for a tax increase that AFSCME’s contract can’t be blamed for. - Mason born - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:59 am: Argh I hate my phone. actions. As Besides that unified caucus is still going to vote for a tax increase….. - Langhorne - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:04 am: ===I hope today’s action marks the beginning of serious negotiations over how we can deliver needed structural reforms and a balanced budget.”=== No, governor, defeating the override doesnt move us one inch closer to passing any part of the turnaround agenda. If you really want “serious negotiations”, you have to back off all or nothing. Show some movement. Talk to the leaders and include the budget. - Excessively Rabid - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:08 am: ==I hope today’s action marks the beginning of serious negotiations over how we can deliver needed structural reforms and a balanced budget.== Well, jeez, so do I, but the guv has not so far been amenable to a reset that would get this process going. If what he is waiting for is total capitulation by the GA on his “turnaround” agenda, he isn’t going to get it. He’s not going to get big gains in the GA in the midterms either, and he has this year and next year to get through first. Rauner has power, but not unlimited power. Like Rich said in his column a week ago, he needs to cut a deal on his agenda (maybe more palatable now that he can claim victory on the override), and then propose an actual budget that doesn’t rely on impossible cuts to the pension obligations. Today, not tomorrow. - Louis G. Atsaves - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:13 am: @Mason born, “===To me it’s the end of the second half and AFSCME/MJM threw a hail mary which failed.===” That was no Hail Mary pass. There was no desperation. It was a cynical move to change the rules of negotiation. There will be fallout with certain legislators on both sides of the aisle over this. That is something both you and I agree upon. In my Lake County, Reps. Yingling and Sente should be busy looking over their shoulders over that vote. - Fedralist - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:13 am: Long term winner- Madigan. Back in the good graces of the Unions. Long term loser (unless he can get a Republican GA)- Rauner. A lot of votes went against him and it shows how difficult it will be for him to get his agenda in the future. - Obamas Puppy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:20 am: Bruce Rauner for the Right to Strike, lets keep that in mind when he puts together his dismantling of public education. - nadia - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:23 am: Rauner wins big, he should now either replace Trump in the billionaire’s slot in the GOP Presidential primary or at least be Trump’s running mate. I’m all far that, this is great! - Strangerthings - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:23 am: I have picked a lane. Willy all of this blame stuff. To most people it’s like watching little children try to sling mud at each other to see who ends up more filthy. You know what you want some perspective on this mess have a look at Pennsylvania. I hear they are having a similar problem only it’s the reverse of us. A Republican assembly and a Democrat governor. - Mason born - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:27 am: Louis Call it a long bomb then. I agree no real desperation and status quo reigns. I don’t see the next election being real favorable for R’s. This is still a deep blue state cone presidential elections. Personally I think your guy blew it. To me he should have took his first 2 years to make incremental changes that are popular with the public fair maps, term limits, etc. while focussing on picking up more R seats and building his popularity. By going super aggressive he’s burned a lot of goodwill. - Honeybear - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:32 am: Bingo A Jack! This will not be your Southern Illinois Coalminer grandfathers strike. I’m talking East St. Louis soup kitchen, union prayer meetings, gospel choir. We will continue to serve the poor, we will continue to walk in Faith and we will stand up to Pharaoh Bruce and Pharaoh Mike! Its a moral choice to support those who protect and help those in need who choose to help others OR actively engage in their oppression (Rauner and the Reps)or turn your head and refuse to see. It’s a choice. - lost in the weeds - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:38 am: increase in wages over the last 25 years, does not support claim of little or no increase in wages in the private sector. http://www.ssa.gov/oact/cola/central.html - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:40 am: - Strangerthings - I thought about responding, but I don’t know what point you’re making, and I don’t think you know what point you’re making either. - Strangerthings - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:40 am: Finally something I agree with thank you mason born. - JS Mill - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 11:37 am: =Congratulations again to Minority Leader Durkin.= Congratulations again to Minority Leader Durkin, your puppet master Bruce Rauner and the party he purchased, cheap. Fixed that one for you Louis. If it is a principle thing, then all members should have voted “no” that is how that works. The GOP and governor sold it that way. And, if that is the case then he did an adequate job. if any vote but a yes was acceptable then ok, I agree with you. I am neither Republican or Democrat. I do not support Madigan who for years has stuck it to most of us. Rauner is just piling on. - BeenThereB4 - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 11:44 am: Allen D: You are wrong. The oft quoted 11.2% was the governor’s interpretation of AFSCME’s opening position. Both sides agreed to negotiate economic issues last, and that portion of the negotiations have not even begun. - Norseman - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 11:53 am: === In general, the middle class and especially the “conservative” middle class has been voting in direct opposition to their best economic interest. For reasons that are not clear, they continue to carry the mail for the true economic elites like Rauner. === JS Mills, the one percenters have enjoyed and encouraged the middle class enmity for government programs for the poor and concomitantly government in general. It’s easy to convince people to hate the poor and the government that helps them. It’s easy for the one percenters and the haters to focus on outlying examples of abuse rather than the total picture of poverty in America. It’s the classic diversionary tactic. - walker - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 12:11 pm: Too much pulling hair and/or waving hands in jubilation on this one. On the labor front nothing has technically changed. We are back to exactly where we were the day before the bill was passed. AFSCME tried to create a new backstop of sorts, and fell just short. On the political front, three changes are significant: Rauner can claim a victory on an element of his Turnaround Agenda, at least in general form. He can now save face and begin to settle the budget differences, which are not great. Or he can take this inch as a sign of momentum and breakthrough, and ask for a mile. Ball’s in his court, and it’s hard to read which way he’ll go. Madigan lost on a vote he apparently thought he had locked, which is a shock to the system. Part of this was Durkin’s clear effectiveness in preventing yes votes, regardless of its sources. Truth is MJM never was the mythical being some like to assume, but it is rare that he misjudges outcomes. Will this new found uncertainty lead to more flexibility on his part? The House Republicans had a real fissure exposed to the world. In this case it was temporarily spackled over. If the moneyed party leaders focus on purity, that will hurt the party. If they figure out ways to manage and support the outliers to maintain and win seats, they will do better. Tough choices for a minority party. Do these slight shifts signal that we will soon be getting past the large personality-driven stakes in the ground, and making some reasonable budget compromises? We can hope. - A guy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 12:19 pm: ===walker - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 12:11 pm: Too much pulling hair and/or waving hands in jubilation on this one.=== Amen, Walk, amen! - Louis G. Atsaves - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 12:21 pm: @Mason Born, long bomb works better for me. “===To me he should have took his first 2 years to make incremental changes that are popular with the public fair maps, term limits, etc. while focussing on picking up more R seats and building his popularity. By going super aggressive he’s burned a lot of goodwill.===” Perhaps. Time will tell. Didn’t seem like he had a lot of goodwill going into office from his opponents. He did try with dinners and personal attempts to reach out to them. The only one “no” vote (Drury) in my opinion had no causative factor after those efforts. I also didn’t see any Democratic movement on fair maps, term limits and other items on his wish (turnaround) list. A few items the Democrats at best nibbled around the edges. Both sides could have handled things very differently from the start. Both sides didn’t. Can’t change that history. But perhaps they have learned a few lessons from all that and will start moving forward. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 12:58 pm: ===Didn’t seem like he had a lot of goodwill going into office from his opponents. He did try with dinners and personal attempts to reach out to them.=== The continued bashing of Madigan and at times Cullerton during the Lame Duck session by Rauner probably didn’t help. I’ve yet to meet someone who bashes people, trashes them publicly that truly expects to be greeted warmly. Rauner always doubled down; mail, TV Ads, press conferences. Rauner isn’t a victim… - Anon - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 1:00 pm: A Jack. So, Butler is sharp enough to not hand an opponent that “voted no on …” club to beat him with. All the vitriol about casting a yes or no vote is nonsense. You either showed up and voted Yes or you didn’t. Nothing else matters, IMHO. How they each chose to do that is up to them. Nitpicking it beyond that is just sore losers and fails to acknowledge that this is all taking place in a hyperpartisan atmosphere where everyone has an eye on what Rauner/Madigan may do to them depending on they vote I love how one day posters here will complain about the simpletons that don’t get state government and in the next breathe pretend politics shouldn’t exist on the biggest vote so far this year. - Mason born - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 1:18 pm: Anon It’s not so much politics doesn’t exist. It’s more the frustration of politicians more beholding to party than to the people who elected them. When I vote for a man or woman they are to represent ME not their party. Otherwise we might as well switch to u.k. style parlaiment. - A guy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 1:59 pm: Mb, does that not go both ways? - Mason born - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 2:13 pm: A Guy Absolutely but it wasn’t Madigan publicly threatening his caucus to stay in line. Which group was 100% unified. I hate blind loyalty to either party. Personally I don’t think the last page of this story has been written. If AFSCME and Rauner negotiate an agreement this is nothing more than a sideshow. If Rauner locks out (spare me his promise crud we both know that was expediency) or does any illegal bargaining tactics it won’t be the yes votes that look like flunkies. A strike is a jump ball. - Demoralized - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 2:20 pm: ==A strike is a jump ball== I’m not sure about that. I believe it would be a big mistake for AFSCME to have a prolonged strike. A couple of days? Maybe. But if it drags on you can bet people will start crossing the picket lines. Nobody can afford to not get paid for an extended period of time. As soon as that starts happening that’s the ballgame in my opinion. And it’s also a severe blow to AFSCME as an organization. In that scenario - again, only my opinion - the Governor wins. He can claim that even members of AFSCME don’t support their own union. Maybe I’m wrong. But that’s how I see it playing out. - A guy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 2:30 pm: Mb, the Speaker wasn’t “public”, but he was understood. I appreciate there’s a difference, but his discipline was in place, and no one can be surprised Drury and Franks weren’t falling into lockstep. Dunkin…who knows that story? There’s definitely more to that. My take, as a partisan, is that yesterday achieved the opportunity for a “do-over” for the Gov’s team and AFSCME. Both have plenty to lose and something to win. Hopefully, both entities will see the value of achieving better results from here forward. - Mama - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 2:38 pm: Why does there have to be a strike? Why can’t AFSCME just say No to Rauner’s final contract demands and keep working? No one gets paid during a strike, and no one can afford to go without a paycheck. - Rich Miller - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 2:39 pm: ===Why can’t AFSCME just say No to Rauner’s final contract demands and keep working? === Doesn’t work that way. - Mason born - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 2:40 pm: Demo My strike vote = jump ball was strictly as to how yesterdays vote will be viewed. If AFSCME can justify themselves to a majority of the public Rauner’s puppets look like what they are puppets. If Rauner sells himself as reasonable it’s the yes votes that look like flunkies. That being said it’s a jumpball between an 8th grader and a high school senior. I agree AFSCME is ill prepared for that ball. - Mason born - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 2:47 pm: A Guy You partisan view point is possible if both sides truly are dedicated to being honest negotiaters to an agreed contract. From what I’ve heard and seen here it is unlikely. Rauner can’t even negotiate with a coequal branch of government. Maybe he can learn humility. - Honeybear - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 2:50 pm: Mama, when last and final is declared it’s an either/or situation. Either you accept the final offer or you call for a strike vote. If the vote is strong enough then you strike if not you accept the last final offer. Okay sorry, for the sports challenged what is a jump ball? I’d really like to understand the post(s). - Mason born - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 2:50 pm: A Guy Actually you could do a lot for the state if you could convince the gov and his boys that he has a lot to loose. I’m not sure his mind can comprehend that. - Mason born - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 2:56 pm: Honeybear A jumpball is a ball tossed straight up in the air that either basketball team can grab. My point was if it comes to a strike and AFSCME can win the pr and look the victim than those that voted no look like flunkies to an out of control Gov. If Rauner wins pr. makingAAFSCME look out of touch the yes votes look like union flunkies. Unfortunately for you AFSCME’s task is a lot harder. - CraftyGirl - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 3:05 pm: “[the] public sector gets reasonable compensation. In many cases, more than reasonable compensation. Good grief, it isn’t difficult to compare job duties in the private sector and see what a really good gig most have in the public domain.” I can only speak for myself. My position requires an advanced degree and a license. The median private sector salary for my position with my years of experience is approximately $119K. I make less than that. Not enough less that I’d argue I’m being unfairly compensated. But at the same time the “taxpayers” aren’t paying me so much that my compensation is “more than reasonable.” I knew going into this that I’d never get rich. What I wanted was a decent career that could support a reasonable middle-class lifestyle, doing work I could believe in. I stay because I still believe in the work I do. Lest anyone think that I’m feeding at the public trough because I “can’t hack it” in the private sector, I work with my private sector counterparts every day. We attend the same continuing education courses. We have the same training. I have every reason to believe that many of them would welcome me into the private sector with open arms. I’ve been told if I ever wanted to leave, they’d find a position for me. I stay because I’m committed to public service. I’m not overcompensated. I’m not a hack. I’m not feeding at the taxpayers’ expense. I am a actually a taxpayer myself (something too many people are all too quick to forget). I’ve served under 5 Governors, including this one. This one might actually cause me to do something that I thought was always unthinkable. This Governor might actually drive me out of public service. - Honeybear - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 3:14 pm: Ahhhh, thanks. Honestly, I think I knew that at one point in junior high but now I get it. I agree on both accounts. Excellent metaphor. I think you’re right AFSCME does have the harder job. - Norseman - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 4:00 pm: CraftyGirl, well said. I’m infuriated by the haters because I know so many good people like you in state government. Unfortunately, I don’t see any hope for you in the long-term future. No raises, if not decreases, significant increases in your health insurance costs, and extremely unresponsive political leadership. If you qualify for early retirement, consider it. In any event, explore your options to leaving state government. Your stress level will probably decrease tremendously. - david starrett - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 4:24 pm: There are “political hacks” in State government, but they didn’t get there out of any commitment to public service. There are many more like CraftyGirl, and the more they are characterized as “hacks” and denied the security they counted on at the beginning of their public careers, the fewer of them will remain to serve the public interest. This is not minor stuff. We’re talking about protecting abused children, seeing that bridges don’t collapse, making sure that air is safe to breath and water safe to drink, and a host of other things that the “private sector” will never find profit in. Government is not a for-profit enterprise, and attempting to treat it that way is to fundamentally misunderstand its public purpose. Thanks CraftyGirl. - RNUG - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 6:19 pm: In my career at the State, I would say 10% - 20% were political hacks or incompetent people that the union protected (a mistake in my opinion). 80% to 90% of the people I saw were like CraftyGirl’ competent to exceptional people who wanted to be public servants and, while decently paid, were usually capable of making a significant amount more in the private sector had they wished to do so. The State needs more people like CraftyGirl … but it’s highly likely most of those career public servants will be retiring or departing for the private sector … and the public won’t realize what they’ve lost until 5 or 10 years from now. - Johnnie F. - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:01 pm: And in 5 to 10 years the State will be offering significantly more in salary and benefits to attempt to bring in the knowledgable people that years of lousy leadership (including current leadership) has driven away. Demonizing each and every state employee will cost significantly in a few years. - Anonymous - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 7:36 pm: Crafty Girl said it so perfectly but the haters just want someone to hate. That alone—the disrespect and abuse by the public —is the reason anyone feeling beaten down in public employment must get out. It will be like a whole new life to be employed in a place where your value (and how much you make) is not constantly debated, discussed and trashed on the daily newspaper front page and at social occasions with others. Just try to discuss private sector employee salaries at a social occasion and see how that goes. Please have some self respect and self preservation. The dedication to doing a great job can be transferred to places where you’re not disrespected. - New Guy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 9:38 pm: I can’t help this, but I keep hearing the arrogance and self-proclaimed intelligence of all these posts. I just started working for the State Government 3 years ago and color me ‘not impressed’. One of my bosses in the private sector set me straight once and told me everyone is replaceable. Do not think for one moment there is not a hundred people that want and can do your job just as well if not better than you at any given moment. Your plight is to fend them off by performing at your best at all times and not bring that into question. I have wrote programs that could automate whole sections of departments in the 3 agencies I have worked for, they were never implemented because there was not staff intelligent enough to operate the programs. - New Guy - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:13 pm: Also, the pride of wanting to work for Public Service for less money than what the Private Sector would offer or pay you for the same job is kind of weak. If that is the case then you really have nothing to lose financially just your ethical beliefs in Public Service. - david starrett - Thursday, Sep 3, 15 @ 10:33 pm: New Guy, if you “have wrote programs” that experienced staff is not “not intelligent enough to operate,” you might want to re-think your programs, since their successful operation is their measure of success. What’s really weak is balancing ethical beliefs with financial gain. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.