47 Comments - Oswego Willy - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:17 am: The collective bargaining aspect, after Rauner foolishly decided all of Labor, including the trades, needed a haircut… heavy, heavy lift. I’d be hard pressed to see Labor say to Dems… “Yeah, after fighting off Rauner these 20 plus months we can see trying to even out collective bargaining” Hmm. - Wow - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:23 am: “Local control” of collective bargaining means screwing decent hard working teachers”.. This coming from a man who makes $50+ million in INTEREST each year. Telling teachers that can’t negotiate salary, work hours etc is the pipe dream of the .01% elite - Overtaxed - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:25 am: The Lewis post is wildly misleading. Yes the teachers union has lost members because they’ve lost kids to charter schools and declining enrollment overall. But the teachers who still teach at CPS have receive outsized raises compared to their peers in the public and private sector. The taxpayers eating the upcoming tax hike to save teacher pensions don’t care how much the “union” has lost; they care about fairness to the teachers who are teaching their kids. By that standpoint, the steady 5-6% annual raises of recent years (COLA’s plus bumps for annual increases in seniority) look darn good, especially from a near-bankrupt school district. - Honeybear - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:25 am: So the private social service agencies in Southern Illinois lay in total ruins and now he’s going to destroy education in order to destroy teachers unions. It is just sick. It is wrong. November All day All night 24/7 365 November - Formerly Known as Frenchie M - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:28 am: If Rauner had any sense, he would have zeroed in on the collective bargaining on the local level — and then attempted to give on bargaining elsewhere (AFSCME, for example — or his failed forays into fair share). There might have been a deal — or at least a desire to compromise toward a deal — had he understood that not every collective bargaining battle was his to win. But by going nuclear on every aspect of bargaining — from Chicago to his own workers to the SCOTUS fair share fight — his ideological rabidity is too obvious and — for most folks, at least — too much to take. - Norseman - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:33 am: Let’s not kid ourselves. Barickman is Ok with losers so long at those losers aren’t in his district. Repealing mandates is small potatoes. It’s all about going after school personnel costs. Raunerites ask why do teachers need to be paid so much. These people are teaching our kids. When mine were in school, I didn’t want to settle with any schmuck off the street willing to take a buck. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:34 am: - Formerly Known as Frenchie M - With respect, Rauner should’ve mended fences with Local 150 and the trades and left Labor out, except for public sector unions not in first responder fields. That was the logical, winning play, isolating state workers and teachers, for example, and leaving out carpenters and police and firefighters. But, Labor caught a break when Rauner went to Decatur and said Unionized workers all make too much money. If Labor can’t convince their memberships that Raunerites in the General Assembly after catching the break Rauner gave, then Raunerites will pick up smears with 2 in 5 Labor households again? We’ll see. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:35 am: “pick up seats” Ugh. Apologies - I'm calling BS on both - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:41 am: 1)I’d like to see Barickman’s theory tested with a poll of superintendents in districts that would likely “lose” if the formula is changed to see if they’d rather get stable funding from Springfield, or collected bargaining reform. 2) I’d like to see Karen Lewis sit down with Chicago fire and police union members (who don’t get compounding COLA’s when they retire) and municipal employees (whose pension fund isn’t getting $250 million a year in new property taxes) and explain to them why Chicago teachers shouldn’t have to pay their employee pension contributions while all other city employees do. - mehh - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:43 am: I hope every Republican in the state campaigns on Sen. Barickman’s theme of cutting school funding to take away union members rights. Please face that “music.” - wordslinger - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:55 am: –Although Rauner has said he doesn’t think any school district should get less money under a revised formula, – By definition, that means a lot more money for education under any formula. Eight billion dollar FY17 deficit, backlog of bills up to $10 billion and counting. There’s seems to be a missing component to all this talk. Make it’s all academic, if not surreal. - Four and a half - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:57 am: OW is exactly right. One of the Rauner’s biggest political misplays was failing to exploit the divide between the trades and public-sector unions. He could’ve used a capital bill to help drive the wedge and would have probably got some workers comp reform out of it. Madigan, who has feuded with AFSCME and the teachers in the past, could have been Rauner’s partner. But Rauner’s anti “collectivist” beliefs clouded his judgement, proving he’s always been more of an Randian ideologue than a pro-business pragmatist. - Honeybear - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 11:04 am: –and are given relief from some of the mandates the state imposes on them.”– So what they can’t do legislatively they will try to accomplish through extortion. Regardless, now they are going after the lives of the teachers who educate our children. - Anonymous - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 11:09 am: ==im calling bs on both == I’d like folks like you to quite getting your undies in a knot over workers/retirees getting those whopping amounts of money (snark) while those 54 million earners are paying single digits in tax. The design is to deflect the attention away from the wealthy onto middle class workers so they can divide and pick each other apart while they skate free. Get it? - RNUG - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 11:10 am: One of the few spots where there is any political room to maneuver is the unfunded mandates. Either give the school districts the ability to ignore the unfunded mandates, or give the school districts the ability to levy an unfunded mandate tax just for those items that is not subject to any property tax cap. That would be some local control, something Rauner claims to want. The other place for some political horsetrading is a property tax cut-back coupled to a general tax increase, either income or sales. Commit the State to a specific level of school funding for each district, 70% or 80% or whatever level is necessary to cut the school district property tax levy in half … and include a cap that the local school district levy can’t rise faster than the rate of inflation UNLESS the voters approve a bigger increase. Yes, it will require a tax increase but, you know what, the income tax is going to have to be increased anyway just to pay the State’s bills. Make it a big jump instead of a little one but reform the school funding at the same time. People see the property taxes much more personally than they do the income or sales tax. You take away part of the sting by lowering the property tax almost in half. Finally, if you want to go whole hog, forbid the school districts from picking up the employee share of the pension contribution and require the school districts, not the State directly, to make the employer pension contribution. This has the advantage, politically, of not bailing out Chicago schools but instead putting the rest of the State on the same footing as Chicago schools in terms of pensions. That, again, gives the local school districts some local control / incentive to bargain harder on salaries and end of career raises. I realize this may be an issue for the districts who don’t currently pay the employee share, so there needs to be a phase in process (in some cases possibly with extra state funding) of the shift over something like 8 years, with equal reductions to employee and equal increase to employer pension payments, until the whole contribution is paid for and budgeted out of the local school district. It’s going to be tough to get the details right … but if everyone screams, it’s probably the right path … and that’s what needs to be done on the school funding. - Honeybear - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 11:10 am: OW is correct. He bit off more than he could chew. Trades can and have been natural allies of what was formerly known as the GOP. Now we are united like never before. - Rod - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 11:13 am: Senator Manar was willing to trade some regulation for money before. The Statewide School Management Alliance has been calling for the elimination of special education rules in Illinois that exceed the clear requirements of the federal Individuals with Disabilities Education Act for several years now along with other deregulation proposals. The Alliance has also supported for a long time what they call unfunded mandates and in general Sen Barickam has supported those ideas. Sen. Barickman of was the lead sponsor of Senate Bill 3098, which would have eliminated mandates for physical education in Illinois schools. The bill would have also allowed a board of education to enter into a contract with a third party for non-instructional services currently performed by any employee or bargaining unit member, and removed a provision that requires any third party that submits a bid to perform the non-instructional services to provide a benefits package for the third party’s employees who will perform the non-instructional services comparable to the benefits package provided to school board employees who perform those services (see http://www.mywebtimes.com/news/local/barickman-proposes-bill-to-save-schools-m/article_f29365b2-4ffd-5d0d-b0f2-625c0b3654cc.html ). Senator Barickman has worked with Senator Manar before (see http://www.pantagraph.com/news/state-and-regional/illinois/government-and-politics/barickman-to-partner-with-manar-on-school-funding-bill/article_6628d95a-203a-5be6-849e-aad389b08484.html ) so there is nothing new here at all. - Hamlet's Ghost - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 11:24 am: Norseman’s comment deserves to be repeated: == Repealing mandates is small potatoes. It’s all about going after school personnel costs. Raunerites ask why do teachers need to be paid so much. == Cutting back on special education would “save” considerable money, mostly in personnel costs. Such cuts would also toss under the bus the most vulnerable children in our state. - Illinois bob - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 11:31 am: @Norseman =These people are teaching our kids. When mine were in school, I didn’t want to settle with any schmuck off the street willing to take a buck.= Unfortunately, that’s what you get in Illinois public education, Norse, because tenure protection of the “schmucks” in K-12, and grossly overpaying for them, particularly in Burb HS. I found that out all too often up until 3 years ago when my last kids graduated. Did you read the study that identified that the average ACT score of CPS teachers was only 19 (state avg is 20.6 for ALL students)? Too often we’re paying engineer, manager and accountant rates for “would you like fries with that” talent…. - City Zen - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 11:38 am: ==2011 – 4% raise, stolen when they had a surplus.== I thought CPS was claiming a deficit that year and the contract language lets them pull back raises in such scenarios. Why sign a contract with such ambiguous language, especially when the other side cannot be trusted? ==2012 – 20% increase in school day/year without commensurate compensation.== Wasn’t CPS’s school day much shorter than every other district to begin with? And with CPS’s declining enrollment, wouldn’t one expect layoffs? And since it’s first-in-first-out and those teachers are at the bottom of the salary schedule, wouldn’t CPS have to layoff more teachers to make their numbers? I’m no fan of CPS, and CTU brings up valid points on funding (hello, TIF!), but these recent comments are lacking much needed context. - Anonymous - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 11:50 am: When will people educate themselves about teacher tenure? Tenure means that you have a right to know WHY you are being released and you have a right to a hearing (as opposed to being told to clear out your desk, today is your last day) In NO CASE does it mean job protection or job protection for life. I personally have seen several teachers’ contracts not renewed. So I’m clueless about how people can think that this never happens. Of course, they’re not teachers so they can make all kinds of ……. - JS Mill - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 11:57 am: @RNUG- well said! I agree with most of what you said and it was very well articulated. The local control/mandate relief has been a canard from the beginning. The state wants out of the MCAT’s and wants to let local districts “choose” to fund them. Last year schools received 75% of 46% (really) of the transportation dollars they were entitled to. For some districts, this loss was larger than the prorated GSA. The state wants school boards to choose what services not to offer, knowing full well that parents will go nuts. Parents will expect those services that have always been mandated. They will not be happy about the change. Some districts receive so little from the state that they are willing to forgo the state funding to do as they see fit. Most district like Adlai Stevenson HS, for example, already go above and beyond what the state requires and would simply prefer the state to buzz off. Stevenson is one of the best schools in America and, although their goofy city council was on the Rauner train, the parents know their kids are getting an outstanding education and will pay the freight. - illini - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 12:01 pm: Norseman - “Barickman is Ok with losers so long at those losers aren’t in his district.” True, as far as K - 12 goes, but what about ISU? - Norseman - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 12:04 pm: illini, you got me there. - Not It - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 12:13 pm: Hey Karen Lewis- how about we start counting the number of ways the taxpayer has given in recent years? How many tax increases have we been forced to endure, and how many more are just around the corner? If you want another dime of my money, I’m demanding some more reform. - Ghost - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 12:23 pm: In all these rauner put ups to “save” money by allowing wages to be reduced without baraging there is one huge peice missing. and a pice that no one in the media ever mentions or asks about…. the actual financial impact of dropping eages by outing the unions. they highlite that gov would be able to make roads more cheaply…. but what happens when the workers, who in the past spent money on food, gas, clothes, cars, recreational activites etc, and made enough to pay taxes…. stop all that soending because their salaries dry up? and the added demand for social services and expense of adding people to social services when they cant afford it. economies grow and flourish from spending by people. - Juvenal - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 12:38 pm: @Oswego Willy - I think Rich might have it backwards. I believe that the school districts that will lose money are mostly Illinois Education Association, mostly in GOP districts. It’s Republicans that are gonna have the bigger problem rounding up votes to weaken collective bargaining rights. Teachers in school districts that are cash-strapped will find it easier to accept changes to work place conditions. - Illinois bob - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 12:59 pm: @ ghost =economies grow and flourish from spending by people.= Only when something worth the cost is produced, ghost. Paying somebody to dig a hole in the morning then fill it in every afternoon neither adds to the economy nor increases the wealth of a community. It only takes the resources out of more productive service. - Arthur Andersen - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 1:33 pm: Bob, I hope you didn’t teach economics. Your hole-digger example is technically correct but practically ridiculous. The entire service sector doesn’t “produce” anything, except maybe PowerPoint decks. That doesn’t mean we should devalue the work of doctors, engineers, and yes, teachers, just because they don’t have a pile of widgets at their workstation at the end of the day. - blue dog dem - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 1:35 pm: OW and Honey. I respectfully disagree to a point. Some of the “trade” rank and file have turned their backs on the total union movement. the 2 out of 5 is not a trend that will change much. - Anonymous - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 1:48 pm: AA To some people an educated workforce is not seen as the end result of schooling. Apparently, these people must be self-educated. I’m sure they did it easily on their own, with no one’s help. But I hope they didn’t attend any school and use my taxpayer money. - Robert the 1st - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 2:54 pm: Teaching provides a wanted/needed service. It does in fact produce something, an educated person. It’s not part of the “broken window” theory. - illinois Bob - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 3:00 pm: @Arthur Anderson =Your hole-digger example is technically correct but practically ridiculous= You obviously have never been involved with Chicago Streets and Sanitation….. =The entire service sector doesn’t “produce” anything, except maybe PowerPoint decks.= You obviously know nothing about the service sector. If I design a bridge that allows someone to build it for half what it would cost otherwise, I’ve created value. If someone in the sec of state office develops a more efficient method of processing documentation, they add “value” and justify their expense. It seems you don’t understand the difference in producing durable goods vs productive service. If you ever understood that concept from macroeconomics, either your memory or teacher failed you…. - JS Mill - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 3:19 pm: Aurthur Anderson = Value Added I think there are many other here that would agree with the above. - Arthur Andersen - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 3:58 pm: Bob, I’m not one to tout my education or credentials as you do, but I’ll just ask RNUG and Rich to vouch for me that I am 1) reasonably qualified to opine on finance and economics and 2) in possession of my faculties. You and I are only a few years apart in age, and I’ve never called you senile, yet lol. Your superficial knowledge of economics and your political bias is revealed by statements like “add value and justify their expense” and “build it for half.” Wrong. RNUG’s and my pension payments, or AA Jr’s active duty military pay, aren’t adding a dime of “value” per your warped definition (unless you count reducing the number of Taliban) but in the aggregate they have a substantial economic impact. Try harder or just keep a cork in it. - illini - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 4:06 pm: Thank you Arthur Andersen. Many of us wait for Bob to be called out, but, I for one, do not care to spar with him or his comments or reasoning. - JS Mill - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 4:43 pm: @AA- IB is like our own Forrest Gump. At one time or another he has claimed to be a: Substitute Teacher, engineer, was present at protests, he is an expert at economics, an investment expert, a campaign worker, an education researcher and statistician, a hr expert, and the list goes on… In the movie it was real, here it is more fantasy island for IB. - Last Bull Moose - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 4:48 pm: AA, thank your son for his service. I may question particular military expenditures, but the collective value they add is tremendous. I think of pensions as deferred compensation. You created value in the past and are getting part of the pay for that today. I am happy that ayour career gave you that option. I don’t get too excited about “savings” that come simply by paying someone less for doing the same thing. That is part of a zero sum game, and I don’t like playing those. When one can actually reduce the hours needed to produce something by 10%, that is a saving that I like. (And yes, I do understand that having good negotiators who can get a good price is a valuable part of the market system.) - Honeybear - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 4:52 pm: –OW and Honey. I respectfully disagree to a point. Some of the “trade” rank and file have turned their backs on the total union movement. the 2 out of 5 is not a trend that will change much.– You may be right but I think we’ve already moved the needle way off the 2/5. Before the election so many of my colleagues in labor HATED Quinn with an unbridled passion and Rauner perfidiously hid his true intensions about unions. Thus I think we’ve narrowed that figure down considerably. However in rural Southern IL you may be right about moving away from labor all together. Heck, I’ve got one right here in my office. It’s a valid point but I think we’ve moved the needle towards labor overall but hardened some other positions. - Honeybear - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 4:58 pm: Blue Dog Dem, it’s why if Friedricks had gone against us I would actually embrace the choosing of sides that the decision would have brought about. People who no longer supported labor could get out. I’d prefer it be that way. Just as I’m sure some Republicans are wishing Trump had gone third party before now. - Chicago 20 - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 5:41 pm: This is another baseless, useless Rauner turn around agenda invented by ALEC. Recently passed legislation by several red states restricting collective bargaining have been overturned in the courts because they violate federal and international laws. http://scholarworks.law.ubalt.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1016&context=ubjil Restricting collective bargaining with legislation has no benefit to the taxpayers and causes economic decline that actually costs taxpayers. https://news.illinois.edu/blog/view/6367/204531 ALEC has been advocating for collective bargaining restrictions as a means to defund labor friendly legislators and candidates. For any legislator to restrict collective bargaining as a way to get a budget passed might as well cut off a limb to reduce weight. http://alecexposed.org/w/images/1/15/1R8-Public_Employee_Freedom_Act_Exposed.pdf - RNUG - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 5:51 pm: Since I know him, I’ll just say that -AA- is qualified to talk about finances in a way similar to Schnorf being qualified to talk about budgeting. I make sure to read what both write. - walker - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 6:19 pm: And I make sure to read RNUG for accurate judgments on what could work, and what cannot. - blue dog dem - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 7:34 pm: Honey. Supporting labor does not mean campaigning for and voting Democratic. That ship sailed for me long ago with slick Willy and NAFTA and now Obama with TPP. It means supporting union made and built products. Remodel your home….it better be with union tradesman…shop at a grocery store…better not see teachers at Wal Mart or Sams. if a public service union member falls into that category..you guessed it. Hypocrite. Being a “union supporter” doesn’t just happen when its time to negotiate contracts. - blue dog dem - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 7:35 pm: Honey. Hope you don’t fall into that category. - RNUG - Monday, Jul 18, 16 @ 10:48 pm: - blue dog dem - I’m with you on that. Try to buy American made and union made products; can’t always do so. - Illinois bob - Tuesday, Jul 19, 16 @ 10:15 am: @AA RNUG’s and my pension payments, or AA Jr’s active duty military pay, aren’t adding a dime of “value” per your warped definition (unless you count reducing the number of Taliban) but in the aggregate they have a substantial economic impact.= It seems that “Forrest Gump” would be a step up in intelligence based upon what you post here. Benefits such as pensions are part of compensation, not a “gift”. It’s part of the cost of hiring you, and part of the cost of the “value” you allegedly provided when you were on the public payroll. If you don’t understand this, I seriously question your knowledge of Econ. As far as JS Mills insults, it’s what we come to expect from a self serving public educational community in Illinois, and insults are their refuge when logical argument fails them. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.