ILGOP dumps on Illinois
Wednesday, May 25, 2022 - Posted by Rich Miller
* ILGOP…
Crain’s Chicago: Illinois loses again as Samsung chooses Indiana for battery factory
In the least surprising news of the week, it was announced that Illinois has missed out on a new large manufacturing employer that chose to locate just an hour’s drive from the Illinois border in Kokomo, Indiana.
Crain’s…
“…South Korean battery manufacturer Samsung and vehicle producer Stellantis today announced that they’ll build a $2.5 billion factory in Kokomo, Ind., about an hour’s drive east of the Illinois state line.
The two companies and Indiana Gov. Eric Holcomb said the facility would create 1,500 jobs, with the total cost potentially rising to more than $3 billion.
Illinois last year had made a run at the plant, which could serve Stellantis’ Belvidere plant. Insiders say the state fell out of the race awhile ago, and the Kokomo facility will be close enough to Belvidere to serve that factory if it is converted to EV production.”
This news comes on the heels of Illinois Democrats crowing about the US Census undercounting Illinois population over the previous decade while ignoring concrete IRS data showing over 100,000 Illinoisans fled the state in 2020 alone.
For Illinois Democrats like Governor JB Pritzker, crafting an alternate reality in which Illinois is actually a healthy state that employers and people want to move to is easier than acknowledging and addressing our highest in the nation taxes, rampant violent crime, and notoriously corrupt state government.
* Meanwhile, from the Economist…
For passengers arriving at the rather faded terminals at Chicago O’Hare, it may not feel like it. But as of last year they are landing at America’s most important port, measured by value of trade. In the north-eastern corner of the airport, a stately if ageing Korean Boeing 747 lands and within ten minutes moves into position outside a giant warehouse. On board, bound in plastic and cord, are 115 tonnes of cargo—mostly consumer electronics, but also pharmaceuticals, food and more. In an hour it will be unloaded, and will soon be on trucks heading around the country. If the cargo is worth the average of cargo processed at O’Hare, that one flight will have brought $14m of imports into America. […]
In 2021, reckons usTradenumbers.com, a website, goods worth roughly $305bn passed through O’Hare, about 6.6% of American trade. It is far from being the port that receives most goods by volume (that is Los Angeles) or even the busiest airport (Anchorage’s moves more goods). But the 2.5m tonnes moved through Chicago is made up of far pricier stuff.
Though they are designed in California and assembled in China, it is Chicago where almost all Apple’s products arrive in America. So, too, do aeroplane engines manufactured by Rolls-Royce in Britain, car parts made in Japan and sensitive medicines synthesised in India. Products from midwestern factories, such as two enormous hotel-kitchen ovens destined for Singapore, are loaded up for the journey out (flying things out to Asia costs a tenth of what bringing things in does).
The pandemic has boosted the airport’s freight business. Before covid-19, people said that “bellies [of passenger jets] are taking over the world, we don’t need freighters”, notes Shawn McWhorter, the boss in America of Nippon Cargo Airlines, a Japanese firm. For Chicago, where most flights are domestic, that was not so positive. But when people stopped flying because of the pandemic, the cargo holds of passenger planes were no longer available. Instead, more freight has been flown into specialised cargo terminals, like the one in Chicago. Since 2019 the amount moved through O’Hare has increased by 47% in value, and almost as much in volume.
And because much of Asia is still restricting travel, the boom is continuing.
* Related…
* An eerily prescient 1997 prediction from the US Census Bureau
- Pundent - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:31 pm:
Of course the ILGOP is dumping on Illinois. It’s all they know. But Illinois rejected the ILGOP’s vision of utopia and the requisite dumping that it required to accomplish the objective. So perhaps a bit of reflection by the ILGOP would be in order? I know, who am I kidding.
- Big Dipper - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:32 pm:
==over 100,000 Illinoisans fled the state in 2020 alone.==
Fled like failed Governor Bruce Rauner?
- Roadrager - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:32 pm:
#IllinoisExodus: It’s real to us, dangit.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:34 pm:
===concrete IRS data showing===
Are they admitting that Illinois added a quarter of a million folks, they just wanna try to add the IRS info to make the old, angry in-law uncle happy?
Is this like the statistical equivalence of “oh yeah, but…”?
- Grandson of Man - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:34 pm:
Spelunkers always gonna spelunk. They can’t even be happy on the day it appears Illinois is on the verge of getting a Chicago casino, one that they themselves voted for (bipartisan capital bill). That’s many jobs, and state and local revenue. Illinois will be prospectively taking casino business away from Indiana every day.
- Baloneymous - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:35 pm:
Didn’t Chicago get #1 metro by Site Selection for corporate relocations for 2021 and #1 for every year since 2013? talk about cherry picking Negative Nancy’s. do better.
- Sue - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:36 pm:
Let’s see - if you want to build a new 3 billion dollar manufacturing facility do you go to a right to work state with low property taxes in a dependable Republican state or do you come to Illinois? I guess we know what Samsun’s secided
- Galway Bay - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:37 pm:
Didn’t Durbin “slip” about Samsung months ago as if a done deal?
- TheInvisibleMan - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:40 pm:
== while ignoring concrete IRS data showing over 100,000 Illinoisans fled the state in 2020 alone. ==
When talking about total population, why would anyone focus only on IRS data of people leaving, and not also on the IRS data showing how many people arrived in Illinois.
Just kidding. I know why.
The GOP is impotent and has no popular policy positions.
- Demoralized - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:40 pm:
And Republicans wonder why they are in the super-minority in Illinois. All they do is whine and moan and complain. They aren’t a party of idea anymore. All they are good for is saying bad things about the state all the time and saying no to everything.
- Benjamin - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:41 pm:
If the Samsung plant was mainly to serve the Chrysler…sorry, Stellantis plant in Belvidere, it makes sense they wouldn’t locate it too close. The companies are working together–they don’t want to cannibalize each other’s labor pool.
This is standard practice for industry today, but good luck explaining that (or anything else) to the ILGOP.
- MisterJayEm - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:47 pm:
The character who wrote that Crain’s article tweeted it out asking “Is @GovPritzker ever going to start reeling in some of those EV prizes he was hoping for?”
Somehow he managed to overlook both the Lion manufacturing facility in Joliet and the expansion of the Rivian manufacturing plant in Normal.
I’m old enough to remember when he still practiced journalism.
– MrJM
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:51 pm:
- MisterJayEm - Bring the high heat, and holding accountable some really… questionable(?)… “both sides” need some light… even if it means ignoring what is going on.
There doesn’t need to see “but, this” when it’s a twisting of a narrative to seem “thoughtful, because journalism”
- Al - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:56 pm:
Seeing non-perishable products being flown in from the other side of the planet says things are out of control. Trade policy, currency valuation, unions, subsiding fossil fuels? Not sure all the causes but the opportunity is we are not charging nearly enough of an excise tax on jet fuel. It is bad enough we fly our flowers in from Colombia.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 12:58 pm:
===It is bad enough we fly our flowers in from Colombia.===
“Because indigenous plants and flowers”?
- Baloneymous - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 1:02 pm:
===It is bad enough we fly our flowers in from Colombia.===
I ordered some pickles that were made in Germany. They were very tasty. was that wrong of me?
- vern - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 1:07 pm:
This messaging plan got the ILGOP completely run out of state government. Sticking with it is a bold plan, Cotton, let’s see how it plays out for them.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HVejEB5uVk
- Norseman - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 1:09 pm:
=== MisterJayEm - Bring the high heat, and holding accountable some really… questionable(?)… “both sides” need some light… even if it means ignoring what is going on. ===
+ 1
- Annonin' - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 1:24 pm:
GOPies always make us so proud. Of course we are certain IN will demand prevailing wage on construction and top wages for plant workers. And they there is the bonus you can marry lst cousins too.
- Seats - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 1:33 pm:
I haven’t followed close. Is this a real miss or a Foxconn sized blessing that the papers tried to pretend was an Illinois miss that we should be upset about?
- 48th Ward Heel - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 1:35 pm:
At this point I just assume any communications by Illinois Republicans are written on the back of postcards from Palm Beach.
==The two companies and Indiana Gov. Eric Holcomb said the facility would create 1,500 jobs, with the total cost potentially rising to more than $3 billion.==
Didn’t we learn our lesson with FoxConn?
- Slugger O’Toole - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 1:44 pm:
== about 6.6% of American trade ==
Imagine what that number would be if we built a modern cargo airport on the south suburban property IDOT has been acquiring for the last twenty years. Speed to market increases too without the traffic/rail bottlenecks at ORD.
- JS Mill - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 1:45 pm:
The ilgop misery spelunkers, who constantly tout cut cut cut must never have heard of the midwest nirvana of Kansas. Another Laffer customer that had to raise taxes after devastating their economy when they cut taxes to nearly nothing, and literally nothing for some.
Cognitive dissonance is strong with the ilgop.
=says things are out of control.=
No, it says the the “just in time” inventory/supply model was incredibly vulnerable to major disruption in inevitable global (or even regional) upheaval. It demonstrates the flaw in the approach.
- Pundent - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 1:48 pm:
=I’m old enough to remember when he still practiced journalism.=
Spelunking isn’t limited to just elected officials. And there seems to be this perverse desire by editorial boards and political commentators to steadily beat a drum of things are bad and they continue to get worse - even if reality doesn’t support the narrative.
- 47th Ward - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 1:52 pm:
===…crafting an alternate reality…===
More projection from the usual suspects.
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:02 pm:
So one wing has spent the last forever harping on Illinois losing people as clear evidence of their every belief. Now the other wing is celebrating and acting like Illinois is now THE destination obviously because of their every belief. Everyone just clings to their spin. Illinois population in 2010 was 12,830,632. From 11-20, there were 1,516,055 people born here and 1,087,735 deaths here. So if you go with the number everyone uses now of 13,000, we had a net loss of 258,952 people, in terms of how many moves in bs moved out. That seems like a loss, but kind of a meh loss at that. It certainly isn’t cause for major celebration or evidence that the sky is falling.
- Excitable Boy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:03 pm:
- I’m old enough to remember when he still practiced journalism. -
Same. Hinz might as well join Kass in his podcast these days.
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:03 pm:
13,000, was supposed to be 13,000,000, sorry.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:06 pm:
===Now the other wing is celebrating and acting like Illinois is now THE destination obviously because of their every belief. Everyone just clings to their spin===
Sure, Jan
The reason all of this is utterly comical is exactly what - MisterJayEm - pointed out.
So I guess you don’t believe Illinois was undercounted? That’s just spin?
See, here’s the the thing;
If you think both are unable to be true… then you can’t grasp why one IS spin… one is NOT spin.
You think this is a thoughtful take, it’s what is wrong with “alternative facts” and giving oxygen to phony narratives… so when facts are introduced they are spin too?
I mean…
- Give Me A Break - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:08 pm:
The GOP candidates and office holders sure seem to know a lot about corruption, perhaps since they keep talking about it they could take time to report it to the proper agencies who will act on the GOP information the GOP can’t be bothered to report.
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:18 pm:
= So I guess you don’t believe Illinois was undercounted? That’s just spin?=
The official census total was 12,812,508. My math above used 13,000,000, which is the number everyone is using now. So it would seem fairly obvious that I believe the census was undercounted. The point remains. The population increased. But more people moved out than moved in, though not by a lot. Id call that more meh than anything else.
- Grandson of Man - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:23 pm:
According to Ald. Tunney, who’s chair of the Chicago casino committee and closing floor debate now, we lose $190 million in opportunity costs (annual basis?) to Indiana. Illinois will be gaining a lot of business from Indiana.
The Chicago casino ordinance just passed.
If the spelunkers and ILGOP love Indiana, why don’t they move there?
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:26 pm:
Shot
=== So it would seem fairly obvious that I believe the census was undercounted.===
Chaser
=== The population increased. But more people moved out than moved in===
Read that. Just *read* that.
The population increased.
More people moved out.
The total difference is roughly a quarter of a million person “rounding error” of a “meh” for you?
Some might call that spin, lol
- Manchester - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:29 pm:
Oh those wacky folks at the ILGOP. If only IL were a right wing Christian white nationalist haven where wages were low, there we no government pensions, no climate change, abortion were illegal, Gays were kept in the closet, immigrants were deported, and women knew their place. Why Il would be a downright utopia. Snark heavily intended.
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:30 pm:
= Some might call that spin=
I sincerely apologize if I didn’t explain my math well. If you take the official census total from 2010, add in the births, subtract the deaths, and assume there was no migration, the population today should be 13,258,952. Since that’s not the case (and obviously there is migration in and out), then it means that 169,368 more people moved out than in.
Yes the population increased. Yes more people moved out than in. These are not contradictory conclusions. Do the math yourself.
- Booker - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:32 pm:
There’s an uncomfortable truth that schools are expanding in Northwest Indiana, while just across the border, consolidation is occurring due to declining enrollment.
- Rudy’s teeth - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:38 pm:
Regarding Samsung’s move across the border…prevailing wages on construction projects and top wages for plant workers do not exist in the universe of Indiana.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:53 pm:
=== Since that’s not the case (and obviously there is migration in and out), then it means that 169,368 more people moved out than in===
Keep in mind… A 2 percent undercount means Illinois grew by about a quarter million rather than shrank by 18,000.
You want to this spin about this exodus while being “meh” of a ridiculous undercount… about the size of Glendale, Arizona.
You call that “meh”
===Since that’s not the case (and obviously there is migration in and out), then it means that 169,368 more people moved out than in.===
Cite, please.
Also, dismissing a population error of +250,000 as “meh” is spin. It just is. It’s ignoring all the negative phony about Illinois population, mainly it didn’t increase.
===Do the math yourself===
The math says the population increased by a quarter of a million, no?
- Captain Obvious - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:53 pm:
Ever hear of childbirth Willy? The population can increase even if more people move out than move in. As far as the census count goes, it seems to me that prior to the actual count, estimates derived from statistical sampling showed outmigration in 6 figures. Then came the actual count, where forms were filled out and a herculean effort was made to physically count every head. This actual count showed a population loss of 18,000. Now we are told that estimates based on statistical sampling indicate that the state was undercounted by 250,000, a 500,000 or so swing from pre census estimates. Of the 3 “counts” then, which is most likely to be closest to correct? I’m going with option B, the actual count, considering the huge variation in the estimates not based on actual counting. It’s kind of like an election, really, with polls estimating the outcome prior, the actual vote count, and exit polls which some use to verify the actual count. Those who refuse to accept election results are branded as deniers. I’d apply the same label to those who refuse to accept the actual census count. Of course, in case of disputes, a recount can always be done, just like in an election.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:57 pm:
Let’s put it another way too?
Illinois was “surpassed” by Pennsylvania?
Not according to the adjusted numbers. Illinois would come in 5th.
Is that spin or do I need to take of my socks and use my fingers and toes to spin that too?
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 2:59 pm:
There was a mistake in my last post, should have read 258,952 more moved out than in. For further clarification and in the aim of utmost accuracy, I used 13 million because that’s the number getting bandied about the most. If you add 250,000 to the actual 2010 census number, it actually gets you to 13,080,632. If you subtract that from the 13,258,932 (2010 census plus births minus deaths), you would get 178,320 more moved out than in. Still meh though.
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:05 pm:
= Cite, please=
As a note in my previous post, that was supposed to be 258,932. Births, 2011 through 2019 are from IDPH. I had to get 2020 births from march of dimes because I couldn’t find it on IDPH website. 2011-2020 deaths are all from IDPH.
= The math says the population increased by a quarter of a million, no?=
Yes it does. The math also says that there were 428,320 more births than deaths during that time. That’s more than 250,000, no? We created new people (I hope I don’t have to explain how that works) but we didn’t keep all of them, nor did we bring in enough people from elsewhere to make up for those who left.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:07 pm:
===should have read 258,952 more moved out than in.===
===I used 13 million because that’s the number getting bandied about the most.===
=== If you subtract that from the 13,258,932 (2010 census plus births minus deaths), you would get 178,320 more moved out than in. Still meh though===
I thought it was all spin.
Here’s the thing, why I’m going through this whole exercise…
The population grew, people are staying, growth was larger than outward migration if the rounding error is 250,00
That’s not spin. That’s just numbers refuting a narrative that first Illinois isn’t growing and further that states are passing Illinois by, when in reality the outward number still can’t out Illinois at a negative growth, quite the contrary, really.
You wanted this idea like the writer in Crain’s where “both are seen” but an overall number is the number. That’s it.
Someone must be staying if *all* these folks are leaving yet…
- Rudy’s teeth - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:09 pm:
For some schools in Indiana the teacher shortage is so dire that districts are floating an “adjunct teacher” position. No college is required but experience in an area suffices. Substitute teachers are hired with a high school diploma or GED.
Funding matters.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:13 pm:
===Ever hear of childbirth===
I guess people are staying to raise their children here?
Unless there a U-Haul index that indicates children 0-5 that are themselves, personally, moving, crib, toys and all.
=== I’d apply the same label to those who refuse to accept the actual census count===
Narrator: the census bureau did the update
Your beef is with the census bureau, not me.
- Rich Miller - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:13 pm:
===The population grew, people are staying===
And people are leaving as well.
- Arsenal - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:15 pm:
==Now the other wing is celebrating and acting like Illinois is now THE destination obviously because of their every belief.==
Nice try and BothSides, but what’s really happening is that that side is celebrating good news about the state.
==Id call that more meh than anything else. ==
You’d call it wrong, then. Context is for Kings, and the context here is that we had been told for a decade that Illinois was shrinking, and that the only way to reverse the shrinking was for everyone to take a paycut. Now we know that we were lied to, that Illinois is in fact growing, that we have a quarter of a million people we didn’t know about. That’s good news.
- H-W - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:17 pm:
I’m with BigDipper. “Fled?” Does Crain’s or the ILGOP have secret access to some bevy of exit interviews, in which people leaving Illinois are asked, “why are you leaving Illinois?”, and “at what what is the nature of your exit strategy? Would you say you are moseying, or fleeing?”
These people need to give it a break. In the absence of any evidence, we can no more discern whether people are “fleeing,” or whether “the 2020 election was stolen.” However, we can reason well or reason poorly (or fail to reason altogether).
As to “a singular plant” locating in Indiana, who cares? Anecdotal arguments are for fishing.
- Arsenal - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:22 pm:
I’m not sure what the “people left” thing is supposed to lead us to conclude. Ideally, would no one ever leave their birth state? Does Illinois need to pursue some policy to make sure that happens? What would that policy be?
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:22 pm:
= The population grew, people are staying, growth was larger than outward migration if the rounding error is 250,00=
No that’s not correct. If growth was larger than outmigration, then the population would have to be more than 13,258,952. I’ve yet to hear anyone, including the Governor claim that it is that high. Assuming the rounding error of 250,000 still only gets you to 13,080,632. My assessment of meh is my own spin. The numbers, however, are the numbers. Feel free to spin as you see fit.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:23 pm:
So I’m clear.
=== So one wing has spent the last forever harping on Illinois losing people as clear evidence of their every belief. Now the other wing is celebrating and acting like Illinois is now THE destination obviously because of their every belief. Everyone just clings to their spin. Illinois population in 2010 was 12,830,632. From 11-20, there were 1,516,055 people born here and 1,087,735 deaths here. So if you go with the number everyone uses now of 13,000, we had a net loss of 258,952 people, in terms of how many moves in bs moved out. That seems like a loss,===
Are people leaving. Yes.
Is there really a “net loss” when ignoring the growth overcoming it?
Is tbthe goal of these exercises the keeping of folks in Illinois?
===We created new people===
They seem to be staying. Some seem to staying. How is that “meh” when the spin was “everyone is leaving”
My apologies, truly. I’ll move on.
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:29 pm:
= That’s good=
Illinois helped grow the global population by 428,320. We grew our own population by 250,000. We kept 58% of the growth we generated so I guess that’s more good than bad. I’m sticking with my “meh”.
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:35 pm:
=Is tbthe goal of these exercises the keeping of folks in Illinois?“
I think the goal of the GOP spelunking is everything is terrible so elect them to change it. The goal of the Democrat celebration is everything is great keep them in power.
The only thing I’m taking away from this is that we’re treading water, but we appear to be ever so slowly making slight progress toward shore.
If I take anything else away it’s that I don’t trust anything that comes out of the census bureau now. 2010 may have been wrong. 2020 appears to be wrong. The ACS done in between was wrong. We’re low! We’re high! We’re wrong!
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:38 pm:
- Wonky Kong -
I’ve moved on. Good luck.
- Also - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:39 pm:
No state wins every time it seeks to attract a new major manufacturing plant. Holding IL to that standard would be a bit ridiculous - under Pritzker we’ve won some and lost some, same as with any other governor. The disappointing part is that states are forced to compete for these plants by offering massive tax and other financial giveaways to big corporations that don’t need them. Frankly I’m glad that IL under JB sticks to our position that if a factory is going to come here it must offer good paying unionized jobs. Enough companies understand that having a high skilled well paid workforce means having a workforce that’s happy and good at what they do. That drives retention which is a good thing. Paying people like crap and treating them miserably like manufacturers can get away with in Indiana and other places doesn’t pay off in the long run.
- Grandson of Man - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:43 pm:
The spelunker narrative is toast. They said we are financial hellhole, we improved our finances. They said we are losing population, we are gaining. They want us to be like Indiana, today Illinois stands poised to gain a casino and thousands of jobs, thanks to business we will take from Indiana.
- Lucky Pierre - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 3:49 pm:
Anyone else see a problem with bragging about Illinois expanding casinos and marijuana dispensaries instead of focusing on attracting good paying private sector manufacturing jobs that can support a family?
- Arsenal - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 4:23 pm:
==Anyone else see a problem with bragging about Illinois expanding casinos and marijuana dispensaries instead of focusing on attracting good paying private sector manufacturing jobs that can support a family? ==
Nope.
- Arsenal - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 4:25 pm:
==I’m sticking with my “meh”. ==
You can do that, but it’s still good. Here’s some stats a very wise person showed me:
“Illinois helped grow the global population by 428,320. We grew our own population by 250,000. We kept 58% of the growth we generated”
But look, it’s OK, you can keep repeating a conclusion that your own evidence doesn’t support.
- Arsenal - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 4:27 pm:
“Illinois growing by a quarter of a million people is only meh.”
Turns out we actually love spin so long as we’re the ones doing it.
- Arsenal - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 4:29 pm:
==
==Anyone else see a problem with bragging about Illinois expanding casinos and marijuana dispensaries instead of focusing on attracting good paying private sector manufacturing jobs that can support a family? ==
Nope. ==
And let’s be clear LP- You don’t actually see a problem with that, either, you only see a problem with Democrats ever winning elections.
- Huh? - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 4:32 pm:
LP - the google keys shows an Illinois casino dealer makes about $50k per year. And a marijuana grower gets about $62k per year.
Manufacturing companies have made a business decision that US employees are too expensive. To “cut costs” they ship jobs to Mexico or the far east. Rather than valuing employees as a capital investment, they are a burden to the company.
Prime example, Carrier made air conditioners in Indianapolis. In 2016, the CEO bragged about “saving money” by moving jobs to Mexico where wages were 80% less than Indianapolis. Over 600 people lost their jobs because of a “business decision”.
It’s nothing personal, it’s just business.
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 4:43 pm:
= But look, it’s OK, you can keep repeating a conclusion that your own evidence doesn’t support.=
The census bureau has a map with the percentage growth by state. Now I didn’t take the time to go and compare it to there latest survey info, but according to the map (and assuming the updated 2% growth for Illinois ), Connecticut, West Virginia, and Mississippi we’re the only State’s with less growth than Illinois. Maybe that ranking changes a little if you take the accuracy survey, but it needs to change a lot to mean much. So yes, growth is good, more moving out than in is bad, 47th place out of 50 for growth is bad. It could’ve been worse. So, meh.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 4:50 pm:
===with less growth===
I’m sorry.
The situation is simple;
We went from a narrative “from some” that everyone and their brother is leaving, “according to some” it was because of policies, corruption, taxes… and it’s by the tens of thousands, well over 100,000
Now it’s spin about growth?
It’s now about what *to* that growth?
Illinois is the 5th largest state in America.
Distrust in our institutions is now a slimy residue of a past administration that failed in this task of the census… “some say” purposely.
I’m sorry, we’re not going to continue to get to “I think we can agree this is all bad” kind of “win the day” that it’s not even in the same ball park as IPI and others still way to portray.
No. Sorry. It’s not.
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 5:03 pm:
= The situation is simple;=
Welcome back. To be clear, I’m not spelunking or celebrating. You’ve never heard that from me. I’ve spent countless hours defending this state to people who say they can’t wait to leave. But I’m also not so blind to reality to go out and trumpet the fact that 46 states grew more than Illinois, that we barely hung on to 5th place, that we had more people move in than out. This census and the update are treading water at best. If you’re the coach of a team that finishes in the bottom 10%, you fear for your job. , you don’t throw a parade. Growing is good news. When 46 out of 50 states grew more, that’s meh. Pritzker is up for re-election. It would be political malpractice if he didn’t try to spin everything positive. But it’s on you if you swallow it that spin.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 5:11 pm:
===It would be political malpractice if he didn’t try to spin everything positive.===
What’s everything?
In this instance, the 5th largest state in America didn’t lose tens of thousands but was underestimated by a quarter of a million people.
The only way to want to spin this bad is to make it a negative, given… that up till a few mints ago it was Illinois lost tens of thousands to ALL the bad.
I’ve yet to read you write anything good about this state, especially on this, tough to see you promoting Illinois when…
=== I think the goal of the GOP spelunking is everything is terrible so elect them to change it. The goal of the Democrat celebration is everything is great keep them in power.
I take anything else away it’s that I don’t trust anything that comes out of the census bureau now. 2010 may have been wrong. 2020 appears to be wrong. The ACS done in between was wrong. We’re low We’re high We’re wrong===
The only thing left is asking me to get off your lawn.
That’s why I came back, there’s a fueled anger, like IPI or Wirepoints. No trust in our institutions, even when they correct?
- Wonky Kong - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 5:23 pm:
= No trust in our institutions, even when they correct?=
Did you forget about how the census just told us that their official number was likely wrong. Do we need to revisit how far off their ACS data was? So no, I don’t have a lot of trust in that institution.
I’m sorry if you somehow feel some fueled anger from me, but I’ve done nothing but present hard data (even if I don’t feel 100%) trust for what came from the census). Maybe you have a different interpretation of meh, but where I come from, it’s a shoulder shrug and a “could have been better, could have been worse”. But if you believe that a nonplussed attitude is somehow fueled anger, then hey, go right ahead. Please don’t let me stop you from celebrating almost finishing last in growth. I’ll be here with my meh, not getting excited either way.
- Da big bad wolf - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 5:24 pm:
=== acknowledging and addressing our highest in the nation taxes, rampant violent crime, and notoriously corrupt state government.===
“Rampant violent crime” isn’t why Samsung chose Kokomo over Normal. Kokomo, Indiana has a much higher crime rate than Normal Illinois where the Samsung plant was considering locating to.
The violent crime rate in Kokomo IN according to citydata.com was 373.4 per 100,000, in Normal IL is was 180.9 per 100,000. For the US the violent crime rate was 205.8 per 100,000.
What else are they gaslighting us about?
I hope this factory helps the people of Kokomo live more peacefully with one another in the future.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 5:36 pm:
=== ‘done nothing but present hard data (even if I don’t feel 100%)===
Then how can you say you presented any hard data at all?
===But if you believe that a nonplussed attitude is somehow fueled anger, then hey, go right ahead. Please don’t let me stop you from celebrating almost finishing last in growth.===
An Illinois cheerleader, for sure.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, May 25, 22 @ 5:38 pm:
=== But if you believe that a nonplussed attitude is somehow fueled anger, then hey, go right ahead. Please don’t let me stop you from celebrating almost finishing last in growth.===
If you believe the data just enough to embrace the negative there…
- Da big bad wolf - Thursday, May 26, 22 @ 7:02 am:
===Now the other wing is celebrating and acting like Illinois is now THE destination obviously because of their every belief. Everyone just clings to their spin.===
“Celebrating” by sending a letter to the Census Bureau to maybe get the federal funds we were shorted? Yes sure people always celebrate when they find out they got stiffed, Einstein.
- Wonky Kong - Thursday, May 26, 22 @ 8:21 am:
= Yes sure people always celebrate when they find out they got stiffed, Einstein.=
From Pritzker’s official statement on the news, end of the quote reads: “ I look forward to celebrating this development with all Illinoisans, including those who routinely badmouth our state.”
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, May 26, 22 @ 8:24 am:
===I look forward to===
Words matter. No one is celebrating.
- Wonky Kong - Thursday, May 26, 22 @ 8:45 am:
I’m not going to acknowledge that last one because it would cause me to lose too much respect for you.
The whole point of my original post is that the census news, without any spin on top, isn’t great. Illinois finished near the bottom of all states. And not just losing to the sun belt. The entire rest of the Midwest outgrew us. It isn’t about the weather, either, as every state that borders Canada also outgrew us. The IPI and their like still have plenty of ammo to badmouth the state. The best takeaway from this is that the spelunkers lose their chance to scream about the state losing population for the first time. So that’s better than it could have been. But it is no cause for celebration or bragging. Have a good day.
- Da big bad wolf - Thursday, May 26, 22 @ 8:51 am:
=== I look forward to celebrating this development with all Illinoisans, including those who routinely badmouth our state.===
Pritzker said he looks forward to celebrating, it would be a future event. He’s not celebrating now.
And we still don’t know if Illinois can get the federal funds we lost or are we just screwed out of it.
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, May 26, 22 @ 8:53 am:
===The whole point of my original post is that the census news, without any spin on top, isn’t great. Illinois finished near the bottom of all states.===
And… there it is.
You’re not a cheerleader, you’re not a “meh”… you want it to *seem* like you are, but in the end, it’s the IPI/Wirepoints “it’s all bad, it’s not good” ridiculousness that is even mentioned in Pritzker’s words…
===including those who routinely badmouth our state.===
That’s the reason I went down this whole road.
“No matter what, it’s bad, k?”
===It isn’t about the weather, either, as every state that borders Canada also outgrew us. The IPI and their like still have plenty of ammo to badmouth the state.===
… and yet it’s refuted here, daily, with actual facts. Inconvenient facts.
When you need the Illinois Policy Institute as the crunch to continue a badmouthing of Illinois…
You had no respect for me anyway. You are taking away nothing
- Rich Miller - Thursday, May 26, 22 @ 9:02 am:
===And… there it is.===
Because he’s basically right.
- Oswego Willy - Thursday, May 26, 22 @ 9:07 am:
I stand corrected. Apologies.